Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Did you put your system together for one or two types of music?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by david k View Post

    Midrange is definitely important but I find the area of lower mid, upper bass to low bass is the most difficult range to reproduce accurately with proper tonal depth and balance, that's where I find Lamm electronics peerless if not messed up by tweaks and powercords. I get to play around with a lot very top end gear and nothing comes close. Bass is the holy grail and very few equipment, speakers, tts, digital players, amps, preamps, cables, power cords, etc. get it right IME. Mids and highs aren't as much of a challenge, plenty of both ss & tube electronics get it good enough but not bass. For the most part it's either anemic and on note bass in your face with wow factor, neither of which is right.
    david
    Hence the need for proper midrange and extending from there first and foremost; Yes, bass is difficult but not impossible; less (while not ideal) is much better than too much sluggish bloat. Nailing bass requires a combination of thought, knowledge, and a fundamental understanding of how it should sound along with a good implementation technique. Of course, one needs speakers and/or subs that actually are capable of doing the job too.

    Originally posted by david k View Post
    I'm not interpreting anything my aversion to the term comes from the conman who coined the phrase, his false dogma and negative values.
    david
    This solidifies my earlier point that I believe the term has more in common with realism than most think. In your case, based on what you just said, it's a personal issue with the term's originator; thus using it for interpretation on your part isn't of interest.

    Originally posted by david k View Post
    Problem with a 2nd or 3rd system always comes down to time and space more than anything else that's why in my thinking it's best to achieve those differing goals in one's main system and if you can't have that flexibility then you have to figure out why. Who knows on the way to accomplishing those other goals one might find audio nirvana (pun intended!). I have 3 listening rooms here full of interesting equipment but the only time they get played is when I have a visitor or client who wants to hear something, otherwise it's the main system providing all the flavors I like and want to hear from time to time. For example a turntable with two arm would allow one to instantly change from a neutral natural sounding cartridge like the vdH Master Sig to the full bodied Dynavector XV1t and swoon in Johnny Hart's deep warm voice.

    david
    This also aligns with my thoughts mentioned before your first post and why I haven't put the second system I mentioned above together as of yet. My main system plays everything I want it to play and allows me to explore whatever music genre I'm interested in. I can and do listen for long periods of time and I'm never tired afterwards; it is very satisfying. I can play any of my tape decks, TTs, or swap cartridges (the most neutral ones or the ones with some character) but I also know which ones are more truthful to the music, to my ears. So, I have those options available now as well.

    The Quad based system I talked about before you posted is not about an alternate sound from the perspective you mention above. It is more of a fun project to build something around a coherent speaker of a different type. It's kind of like having a nice sedan or SUV that does everything for daily activities while keeping a vintage vehicle in the garage for fun rides.

    Dre
    Last edited by Dre_J; 08-08-2020, 11:22 AM.
    **************************************************
    Every day is a good day to play analog.
    - 12" 33-1/3 RPM or 45 RPM vinyl
    - 10.5" 15ips or 30ips tape
    **************************************************
    Every day is a good day for live music.
    **************************************************

    Comment


    • #17
      I fell in love with the ML3 pre-production unit in 2008 where there was only one working unit at that time and no Sig series siblings yet. I remember Jeff Catalano and I talking about how we were both actually enjoying a CD being played LOL Alas, even as a Lamm distributor getting high on his own supply, I fear I would not have the funds and space for them and speakers to do them justice. The space would certainly be the most expensive part!

      I also agree with David that Bass is definitely the hardest to get right/real. My tastes also lean towards dipole sound so I surely get where Dre is coming from. For small ensemble classical, best I've heard in terms of purity and gestalt would be the Victor Sierra horns I babysat with ML2.1s. David's is obviously the Maybach to the C Class I babysat but I think I got at least a taste. Should my tastes evolve further as my desire for rocking out decreases it is surely an avenue I would explore. I'm still in the AMG stage of life LOL i just turned 50 after all

      Comment


      • #18
        seems to me a really balanced system would ,make all genres of music sound their best,
        Magnepan 1.6 QR Loudspeakers, Amherst A-2000 MOSFET 150 WPC Amp, Conrad Johnson PV-10A Modded Tube Line & Phono Stage, Electrocompaniet MC II Class A Head Amp, Audio Technica AT-OC9XML Cart (Stereo) , Graham Engineering 2.2 Tonearm (Stereo) , VPI Aries-1 Turntable (Stereo) , VPI Clamp, Denon DL-102 Cart, (Mono) , Luxman Tonearm (Mono) , Kenwood KD-500 Turntable (Mpmp) , Michell Clamp, Marantz 20B Analog FM Tuner, Pioneer SACD, Onkyo DX-6800 CD Transport, DIY 24B/192K DAC, Sennheiser HD-650 Headphones, Headroom Max Balanced Headphone Amp, DIY Silver Interconnects

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Dre_J View Post
          Is your music system geared (no pun intended) to one or two types of music?
          My first reaction was everyone was like me and listened to lots of different musical genres. Then I got to thinking about all my audiobuddies and realized that pretty much all but one of them listened exclusively one type of music eg. jazz, rock, classical, etc. Only one person listened to two types of music and that was jazz and classical. So is it true that audiophiles who listen to all types of music are the minority rather than the majority?

          Did you put it together with specific types of music you like as a priority? If so, what are they?
          I've been batting your question around in my head for a while and not sure I have an answer. It seems like the perennial NFL draft question. Do you draft for need or draft the best player available? Me? I just chose equipment that I thought sounded the best and let the chips fall where they may. That approach seems to have worked as I don't think the system favors one type of music over another. In all honesty though, I think my system sounds best with judiciously close miked recording where it can show off the ability to localize and bring individual musicians to life. But maybe this is true for many systems? Certainly large scale music is challenging for any audio system.

          But certainly I can see some audiophiles choosing their gear based on what they listen to. For example, classical music lover might chose equipment that produces the best dynamics.

          Is your system put together for multiple types of music playback but excels in the areas of music you feel are more important to you, personally? Any examples?

          What was/is you goal for the system you put together in terms of music playback? (certain types, certain styles, etc.)

          Dre
          I think sometime the best plans of mice and men go oft awry.

          My priorities have evolved over the years but one thing hasn't changed: the ability to reproduce vocals. What has changed is I am less tolerant of colorations and noise. Noise especially emanating from the playback of records. That is where I find direct drive turntables and their vanishingly low noise floor more to my liking. In other words, I want the music to sound like what I hear live without editorializing. Or music sounds like it should sound like rather than what I'd like it to sound like. It is possible to have the best of both worlds here. The musical ease without the attendant colorations/distortions. However pleasing these colorations may be.

          Some things that are important for me in reproducing different types of music:

          Classical: sense of size and space, dynamic ease and ability to move between dynamic levels, full frequency response
          Rock: ability to deal with complexity of music, transient attack
          Jazz: sense of rhythm, hearing the musical grid, musical accents, harmonies
          Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
          Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
          ________________________________________

          -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
          -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
          -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
          -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
          -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
          -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
          -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
          -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
          -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
          -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by JCOConnell View Post
            seems to me a really balanced system would ,make all genres of music sound their best,
            That seems like saying in a perfect world. Or the perfect diet. They don't exist. Or rarely.

            But do you think any one system can field all the attributes to reproduce the necessary qualities to playback all music genres? Jack of all trades and master of none comes to mind here. There are just too many tradeoffs to any system.
            Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
            Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
            ________________________________________

            -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
            -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
            -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
            -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
            -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
            -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
            -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
            -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
            -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
            -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post

              My first reaction was everyone was like me and listened to lots of different musical genres. Then I got to thinking about all my audiobuddies and realized that pretty much all but one of them listened exclusively one type of music eg. jazz, rock, classical, etc. Only one person listened to two types of music and that was jazz and classical. So is it true that audiophiles who listen to all types of music are the minority rather than the majority?
              That's a good question. I'm guessing if the lure of or hobby was born out of our prior listening habits (which are more likely to be maybe two or three genres at best) it may be less than half our hobby participants who listen to multiple types of music. many of my associates branch out and explore later in life or later on in the hobby.

              Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post

              I've been batting your question around in my head for a while and not sure I have an answer. It seems like the perennial NFL draft question. Do you draft for need or draft the best player available? Me? I just chose equipment that I thought sounded the best and let the chips fall where they may. That approach seems to have worked as I don't think the system favors one type of music over another. In all honesty though, I think my system sounds best with judiciously close miked recording where it can show off the ability to localize and bring individual musicians to life. But maybe this is true for many systems? Certainly large scale music is challenging for any audio system.

              But certainly I can see some audiophiles choosing their gear based on what they listen to. For example, classical music lover might chose equipment that produces the best dynamics.
              That makes sense.

              Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post

              I think sometime the best plans of mice and men go oft awry.

              My priorities have evolved over the years but one thing hasn't changed: the ability to reproduce vocals. What has changed is I am less tolerant of colorations and noise. Noise especially emanating from the playback of records. That is where I find direct drive turntables and their vanishingly low noise floor more to my liking. In other words, I want the music to sound like what I hear live without editorializing. Or music sounds like it should sound like rather than what I'd like it to sound like. It is possible to have the best of both worlds here. The musical ease without the attendant colorations/distortions. However pleasing these colorations may be.

              Some things that are important for me in reproducing different types of music:

              Classical: sense of size and space, dynamic ease and ability to move between dynamic levels, full frequency response
              Rock: ability to deal with complexity of music, transient attack
              Jazz: sense of rhythm, hearing the musical grid, musical accents, harmonies
              Thanks for sharing your thoughts and priorities.

              Dre
              **************************************************
              Every day is a good day to play analog.
              - 12" 33-1/3 RPM or 45 RPM vinyl
              - 10.5" 15ips or 30ips tape
              **************************************************
              Every day is a good day for live music.
              **************************************************

              Comment


              • #22
                Dre, it was very simple for me. My two categories are classical and non-classical. Larry

                PS. General Ulysses Grant (later President Grant) is quoted as saying, "I only know two tunes. One of them is Yankee Doodle, the other one isn't."
                Analog- VPIClassic3-3DArm,SoundsmithZephyrII+MiyajimaZeroMono, 2xAmpex ATR-102,Doshi3.0,Merrill Trident Master Tape Pre,Herron VTPH-2A
                Dig Rip-Pyramix,IzotopeRX3Adv,Mykerinos,PacMicroModel2
                Dig Play-mchNADAC, LampiPac, Roon, HQP, Oppo105
                Electronics-Doshi Pre,CJ MET1mchPre, Cary2A3monoamps
                Speakers-AvantgardeDuosLR,3SolosC,LR,RR
                Other-2x512Engineer/Marutani Symmetrical Power, AudioDiskVinylCleaner,AirTightRecordFlat, Scott Rust Interconnects,
                Music-15KRecs(90%classical),1.3KR2Rtapes,50TBrips

                Comment


                • #23
                  I know I didn’t think it that deeply. Started low to mid hifi as a teenager. Did start with separates because my father liked gear and there was no way a son of his would get one of those 70’s all in one kits. I went to McIntosh cause my father aspired to own their stuff so I decided to finish the journey..
                  Amp - McIntosh MC402
                  Pre - McIntosh C2300
                  Phono - JE Audio HP10
                  TT - VPI Prime (2 3D Arms and Victor UA-7045)
                  CD - AMR CD777
                  R2R - Pioneer RT 1020L
                  Speakers - PMC OB1i’s or Aerial Acoustics Model 8’s

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    "We have both kinds of music... Country and Western" - Lady bar owner in The Blues Brothers

                    But seriously, I like all forms of music and my goal has been to play any music at any level without compromise. Everything from a whisper to all out live concert in my dedicated listening room. To recreate the venue such as the intimacy of a smokey jazz club or impact of Fleetwood Mac in a stadium or grandeur and scale of a full symphony orchestra.
                    Speakers/Amps: Genesis G2.2 Jr with Powered Servo-Sub Bass, Genesis GR1440 Mono Amps, 5,000 watts total power
                    Preamp: SMc Audio VRE-1C Preamp (fully balanced inputs and output)
                    Phono 1: VPI Prime Signature Belt-Drive Turntable with 10” 3D Printed Uni-pivot Arm and Ortofon MC Windfeld Ti Phono Cartridge driving Lehmann Decade Phono Preamp
                    Phono 2: VPI HW-40 Direct-Drive Turntable with 12” 3D Printed Fat Boy Gimbal Arm and Ortofon MC Anna Diamond Phono Cartridge driving Genesis Gold Phono Preamp
                    R2R Tape: Studer A810 with Bridge Console
                    Digital: Battery Powered Laptop running software on SSD, Music Files on USB SSD, and playback by JRMC. USB interface to M2Tech Young DAC
                    Cables: Genesis Advanced Technologies/Absolute Fidelity Interface Interconnects, Speaker, Phono and Power
                    Power: Audio-Ultra Power System, IsoTek Super Titan Passive Power Conditioning for Amplifiers
                    Accessories: Custom Acrylic Equipment Stands, Klaudio Ultrasonic RCM

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      BTW I've felt that whether by planning or not, certain type of speakers are custom made certain types of music. Stats, for instance, just eat up instruments like harpsichords, harps and guitar. Magnepans at their best really do a great job of conveying the speed of a stand up bass. The big Infinities excelled at recreating organs and that ability to move air. (something that seems elusive for many speakers even today.) In the old days, some of the small British mini-monitors really gave a great sense of space.
                      Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                      Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                      ________________________________________

                      -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
                      -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
                      -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                      -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
                      -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                      -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                      -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                      -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                      -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                      -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post
                        BTW I've felt that whether by planning or not, certain type of speakers are custom made certain types of music. Stats, for instance, just eat up instruments like harpsichords, harps and guitar. Magnepans at their best really do a great job of conveying the speed of a stand up bass. The big Infinities excelled at recreating organs and that ability to move air. (something that seems elusive for many speakers even today.) In the old days, some of the small British mini-monitors really gave a great sense of space.
                        I can see, and have observed, where certain types and brands of speakers seem to have complimentary characteristics that could favor one type (or genre) of music vs. others. That character could add some reasoning for the choices some of us make when deciding on speakers and components used in systems; especially if the goal is enhancement of certain types of preferred music or an 'I like this type of sound' moment.


                        **************************************************
                        Every day is a good day to play analog.
                        - 12" 33-1/3 RPM or 45 RPM vinyl
                        - 10.5" 15ips or 30ips tape
                        **************************************************
                        Every day is a good day for live music.
                        **************************************************

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X