Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Drawing a line in the sand!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Drawing a line in the sand!

    In progressive rock the two most often-cited cases whereby people have taken a side when bands change lineups are Pink Floyd and Genesis. The departures of Syd Barrett from Pink Floyd and Peter Gabriel from Genesis are hotly debated and discussed and many think those two bands are but shadows of their former selves. I personally don't subscribe to that notion as both created great albums prior to and also post departure. To a lesser degree the later departures of Roger Waters from Pink Floyd and Roger Hodgson from Supertramp had an impact, but by that point both bands were already past their prime IMO. However, had both remained, who knows what they would/could have brought to the table.

    Have you drawn a line in the sand with regards to the above, and what other examples of band line-up changes do you feel impacted their output either positively or negatively.
    Dynavector DV20x2L MC cartridge - Genesis G7.1f speakers - Marantz Reference PM-KI-Pearl Int. Amp. - Oracle Audio Paris MkV turntable - Various Morrow & Valab/King cables

  • #2
    I thought we had this discussion about Pink Floyd before. I don't know anyone who cares about Syd Barrett. He left Pink Floyd in the Stone Age and nobody who was born in the last 50 years probably knows who he is or that Shine On You Crazy Diamond was written about him. Roger Waters leaving Pink Floyd took all of their (Pink Floyd's) angst/depression and he walked out the door with it.

    ​The plane crash that killed key members of Lynyrd Skynyrd also killed the rest of the band. The surviving members just didn't realize it. CCR without John Fogerty is a joke. John Fogerty without the rest of the CCR band is still quite respectable.
    Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by mep View Post
      I thought we had this discussion about Pink Floyd before. I don't know anyone who cares about Syd Barrett. He left Pink Floyd in the Stone Age and nobody who was born in the last 50 years probably knows who he is or that Shine On You Crazy Diamond was written about him. Roger Waters leaving Pink Floyd took all of their (Pink Floyd's) angst/depression and he walked out the door with it.

      ​The plane crash that killed key members of Lynyrd Skynyrd also killed the rest of the band. The surviving members just didn't realize it. CCR without John Fogerty is a joke. John Fogerty without the rest of the CCR band is still quite respectable.
      While I usually get a chuckle from your posts and contributions, I find this reply rather dismissive and it seems obvious to me that you haven't spent much time on more music-dedicated fora. If you had then you'd quickly realize many PF fans (regardless of age) are quite strongly divided.
      Dynavector DV20x2L MC cartridge - Genesis G7.1f speakers - Marantz Reference PM-KI-Pearl Int. Amp. - Oracle Audio Paris MkV turntable - Various Morrow & Valab/King cables

      Comment


      • #4
        I'd say that the later Fleetwood Mac was a lot better than its original incarnation with Peter Green. But like PF, I have friends who will argue that it was the end of Fleetwood Mac when Green split. Is putting a group of music lovers in a room and expecting them to agree any different than audiophiles?
        Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
        Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
        ________________________________________

        -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
        -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
        -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
        -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
        -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
        -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
        -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
        -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
        -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
        -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

        Comment


        • #5
          Sorry Johnny. No, I don't hang out on any PF forums or any other band worshiping forums for that matter. Pink Floyd was founded in 1965 and Syd was gone by April of 1968. I was only slightly off when I said nobody who was born in the last 50 years probably even knows who Syd was. It's been 48 years since he left Pink Floyd and he was only on their first two LPs. I had no idea that people were divided on the merit and worth of Pink Floyd since Syd left the band. Syd left in 1968 and Roger Waters left in 1985. You tell me who had more of an influence on Pink Floyd. I'm voting for Waters and I guess that is why I was dismissive with regards to Pink Floyd falling apart after Syd left the band.

          Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post
            I'd say that the later Fleetwood Mac was a lot better than its original incarnation with Peter Green. But like PF, I have friends who will argue that it was the end of Fleetwood Mac when Green split. Is putting a group of music lovers in a room and expecting them to agree any different than audiophiles?
            No difference whatsoever to be sure. With regard to Fleetwood Mac I'd go so far as to say I liked them most when Bob Welch was involved.
            Dynavector DV20x2L MC cartridge - Genesis G7.1f speakers - Marantz Reference PM-KI-Pearl Int. Amp. - Oracle Audio Paris MkV turntable - Various Morrow & Valab/King cables

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Johnny Vinyl View Post
              No difference whatsoever to be sure. With regard to Fleetwood Mac I'd go so far as to say I liked them most when Bob Welch was involved.

              As good as Fleetwood Mac is on record, they are amazing in concert. No stereo system will ever recreate Mick Fleetwood's drums!

              Personally can't get enough of Stevie Nicks with Fleetwood Mac or her solo efforts.
              Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
              Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
              ________________________________________

              -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
              -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
              -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
              -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
              -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
              -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
              -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
              -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
              -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
              -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

              Comment


              • #8
                Johnny-I agree. We can't get audiophiles to agree on anything except that we don't agree and it's no different with tastes in music. Some people claim to hate the Beatles so go figure.
                Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by mep View Post
                  Sorry Johnny. No, I don't hang out on any PF forums or any other band worshiping forums for that matter. Pink Floyd was founded in 1965 and Syd was gone by April of 1968. I was only slightly off when I said nobody who was born in the last 50 years probably even knows who Syd was. It's been 48 years since he left Pink Floyd and he was only on their first two LPs. I had no idea that people were divided on the merit and worth of Pink Floyd since Syd left the band. Syd left in 1968 and Roger Waters left in 1985. You tell me who had more of an influence on Pink Floyd. I'm voting for Waters and I guess that is why I was dismissive with regards to Pink Floyd falling apart after Syd left the band.
                  No question that RW had much more of an influence IMO and I'm also not a Syd Barrett fanboy. I brought up the thread as I find this type of music discussion interesting. It brings out all kinds of logic and reasoning and I think, as a music fan, there is something to be learned from it all.

                  Dynavector DV20x2L MC cartridge - Genesis G7.1f speakers - Marantz Reference PM-KI-Pearl Int. Amp. - Oracle Audio Paris MkV turntable - Various Morrow & Valab/King cables

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by mep View Post
                    Johnny-I agree. We can't get audiophiles to agree on anything except that we don't agree and it's no different with tastes in music. Some people claim to hate the Beatles so go figure.
                    Say it ain't so...pleeeeeeeaaaase!
                    Dynavector DV20x2L MC cartridge - Genesis G7.1f speakers - Marantz Reference PM-KI-Pearl Int. Amp. - Oracle Audio Paris MkV turntable - Various Morrow & Valab/King cables

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Another group that went though a lot of iterations was Yes. Personally, they weren't the same after Rick Wakeman left the group. It would be like ELP without Keith Emerson.
                      Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                      Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                      ________________________________________

                      -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
                      -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
                      -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                      -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
                      -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                      -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                      -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                      -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                      -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                      -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Johnny Vinyl View Post
                        Say it ain't so...pleeeeeeeaaaase!

                        Based on what you are telling about Syd Barrett, there just might be a Beatles forum somewhere that people are discussing how the Beatles were never the same once Pete Best was given a Beatle boot up his butt.
                        Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

                        Comment


                        • Johnny Vinyl
                          Johnny Vinyl commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Or how Ian Stewart was treated as a founding member of the Stones by Andrew Loog Oldham.

                      • #13
                        Originally posted by mep View Post


                        Based on what you are telling about Syd Barrett, there just might be a Beatles forum somewhere that people are discussing how the Beatles were never the same once Pete Best was given a Beatle boot up his butt.

                        Aren't they the same people who say Paul McCartney was overrated?
                        Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                        Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                        ________________________________________

                        -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
                        -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
                        -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                        -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
                        -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                        -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                        -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                        -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                        -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                        -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

                        Comment


                        • Johnny Vinyl
                          Johnny Vinyl commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Only the John Lennon fans say that.....:P

                      • #14
                        Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post


                        As good as Fleetwood Mac is on record, they are amazing in concert. No stereo system will ever recreate Mick Fleetwood's drums!

                        Personally can't get enough of Stevie Nicks with Fleetwood Mac or her solo efforts.
                        One of my earliest audiophile torture moments was when I visited an audio store in Raleigh Durham area in the 70's when I had no money but good ears. The store was playing Rumors on a new then Technics direct drive turntable with unknown amplification driving a pair of Maggies. I was blown away by the music and overtaken by the lust for the gear and voice of Stevie Nicks.

                        About ten years ago, I ran into Mick Fleetwood in the Charlotte airport. He was a strange person but interesting and nice.

                        I also have the Buckingham Nicks LP that took a long time to get a sealed copy.

                        Comment


                        • #15
                          The odd part about Pink Floyd is that if Syd Barret hadn't left, their best albums would never have been made, I can't imagine Barret being involved in Meddle, DSOTM or Wish You Were Here.
                          Steve Lefkowicz
                          Senior Associate Editor at Positive Feedback
                          -
                          Analog: Linn LP12 (MOSE/Hercules II), Ittok, Dynavector 19a, iPhono2; Pro-Ject RPM-1 Carbon, Sumiko Pearl, iFi iPhono.
                          Digital: Samsung 300E5C notebook, JRiver Media Center 26, Tidal HiFi and Qobuz Studio), iFi iDAC2, iFi iUSB3, iPurifier2.
                          Electronics: Burson Conductor Virtuoso, DIY switch-box with TKD 10K pot, Antique Sound Labs MG-SI15DT-S, Burson Timekeeper Virtuoso, Jolida JD1000P, B&K ST140.
                          Speakers: Tekton Double Impact, Tekton Lore, Magneplaner .7, ELAC Debut2 B6.2, Debut F5 and Debut B6, Emotiva Airmotiv B1, Sound Dynamics 300ti.
                          Interconnects: Morrow Audio MA1, Vermouth Audio Black Pearl, Nordost Solar Wind, Audioquest Evergreen
                          Speaker cables: Morrow Audio SP4, Vermouth Audio Red Velvet, Nordost Solar Wind, Nordost Flatline, Audioquest Q2.
                          Digital cables: Straightwire USB Link, Aural Symphonics Digital Standard xxv USB, Belkin PureAV.
                          Accessories: Sound Organization turntable shelf, Mondo racks, Pangea Audio Vulcan racks, Pi Audio Group Über BUSS, Monster HTS2000 power conditioner, Sound Organization speaker stands, Pangea Audio speaker stands, Kinetronics anti-static brush, Pro-Ject VC-S record cleaner, Spin Clean record cleaner.
                          Headphones: Schiit Valhalla amp, Meze Audio 99 Classic and 99 Neo, Beyerdynamic DT770Pro, 1More Triple Driver Over Ear, 1More MK801, 1More Triple Driver IEM

                          http://www.audionirvana.org/forum/ti...ounding-system

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X