Beatles LP Mono Collection

[mep]

I'm curious as to the number of people on our forum who love the Beatles LP Mono Collection and think it sounds better than any previous LPs of the same albums they currently own. If this describes you, are you strictly playing back the mono LPs with a mono cartridge?

I recently acquired another tonearm that I hope to have setup in the not too distant future with a mono cartridge so I can hear these LPs as intended. However, I have other mono LPs in my collection and I think they sound just dandy played back with a stereo cartridge which is why I never had my hair on fire to go through the trouble and expense of having an arm setup for mono.

[Bill Hart]

I have the set, think it sounds great using my stereo cartridge, but at one point, talked with Jonathan Carr about the advantage of using a mono cartridge even though the record was cut using a modern lathe. I don't remember the details of the discussion, but I seem to recall he thought it would sound better. I gather that even with a modern lathe, it is still cut in true mono--laterally, rather than dual channel mono, so vertical movement of stylus would cause some degree of distortion. Others who regularly employ mono set ups for modern mono cut records can probably speak more knowledgeably than me. I suspect for early mono cuts, the differences may be even more pronounced, though a modern stylus profile may avoid some of the noise from wear, but I'm speculating.....

[jazdoc]

Better, definitely better...

[tom_hankins]

For me, well worth the money. Love them with my stereo Benz LP-Smr cartridge and a little more with my Ortofon Quintet mono. Have not listened to them with an older mono cartridge.

[mep]

Bill-Thanks for your response. Do you have any of the early EMI Parlaphone LPs either mono or stereo to compare to the Mono collection? One of these days when I have more time on my hands I'm going to go through the Mono collection album by album and compare them to both my BC-13 collection as well as the single LPs I have collected over the years. For the here and now and using a stereo cartridge mind you, I'm not as impressed with the mono collection as some others appear to be. The Beatles Mono Box LP collection is "cool" and I'm glad I own it, but to me it's more different than it's "better." My opinion could certainly change after hearing the mono LPs played back with a mono cartridge.

To my knowledge, all of the Beatles LPs up through at least Sgt. Pepper were recorded through an all tube recording chain. It's a shame that the mono collection couldn't have been made by using the same tape decks that were used in the original recording process instead of the Studer that was used. But then, maybe I just don't care for the mono mixes as much as the stereo mixes. I'm going to throw out one LP as an example: Beatles for Sale. I have an early EMI Parlaphone pressing (or certainly 'earlier') in the gatefold jacket, but it's not an original pressing as mine doesn't have the yellow label. The stereo EMI Parlaphone LP sounds much more real than the mono LP. Instruments sound more real and lifelike and the voices are so much better to my ears. There is more punch and impact with the stereo LP. Listen to "Every Little Thing" and tell me the timpani doesn't have way more depth and impact as it's struck vice the mono version.

[tom_hankins]

First off, to me, the original emi parlaphone LPs are the best Beatles recordings. At least that I own. That said I am not a fan of many early stereo recordings because of the far left, right imaging. I would prefer mono of the same if I can get them. That's just me. I almost always grab a Beatles mono over stereo recording, even if production may lack a little.

[mep]

For me, well worth the money. Love them with my stereo Benz LP-Smr cartridge and a little more with my Ortofon Quintet mono. Have not listened to them with an older mono cartridge.

Are you saying you don't hear that much of a difference between your stereo and mono cartridges because I'm certainly curious as to how much of a difference it makes.

[tom_hankins]

There is a focus and clarity that I hear when using a mono cartridge with mono records. Depending on the record it comes to light more or less. IMO if you own many mono records, a mono cartridge is a good investment. A good thing is that when compared to great stereo carts the monos are fairly cheap for same performance level.

[mep]

I am specifically asking you about the Beatles Mono collection LPs Tom. Do you hear greater focus and clarity when playing them back through a mono cartridge than a stereo cartridge?

[tom_hankins]

I prefer the Beatles mono records with a mono cartridge. If they were my only mono records I doubt I would go get another table/arm/cartridge setup. But to me they sound better with my mono cartridge.

[Bill Hart]

Bill-Thanks for your response. Do you have any of the early EMI Parlaphone LPs either mono or stereo to compare to the Mono collection? One of these days when I have more time on my hands I'm going to go through the Mono collection album by album and compare them to both my BC-13 collection as well as the single LPs I have collected over the years. For the here and now and using a stereo cartridge mind you, I'm not as impressed with the mono collection as some others appear to be. The Beatles Mono Box LP collection is "cool" and I'm glad I own it, but to me it's more different than it's "better." My opinion could certainly change after hearing the mono LPs played back with a mono cartridge.

To my knowledge, all of the Beatles LPs up through at least Sgt. Pepper were recorded through an all tube recording chain. It's a shame that the mono collection couldn't have been made by using the same tape decks that were used in the original recording process instead of the Studer that was used. But then, maybe I just don't care for the mono mixes as much as the stereo mixes. I'm going to throw out one LP as an example: Beatles for Sale. I have an early EMI Parlaphone pressing (or certainly 'earlier') in the gatefold jacket, but it's not an original pressing as mine doesn't have the yellow label. The stereo EMI Parlaphone LP sounds much more real than the mono LP. Instruments sound more real and lifelike and the voices are so much better to my ears. There is more punch and impact with the stereo LP. Listen to "Every Little Thing" and tell me the timpani doesn't have way more depth and impact as it's struck vice the mono version.

Mep I don't have any of the original Parlaphone monos, but a neighbor, who has a vast collection of serious records does, and did compare them (without me present) and said he thought the current mono box was very close. Aside from cost, there is condition--those monos were likely played on kludgey arms of the time, who knows what kind of cartridges- probably old style ceramic cartridge needles.
I do have a few other odd Beatles pressings here and there- the Rubber Soul red Japanese mono from 82 (narrow obi)- i think the new mono is better on my rig, not as bass-y; one of those white vinyl White albums from the UK that was cut in the late '70s, I think--stereo- it is very good, but the White album is kind of a mess, sonically, in my estimation. That Horzu Die Beatles with -2 lacquers, which is amusing because it is "dry"- no added reverb. But, I'm not the consummate Beatles record collector (I did buy an early UK blue box, in part because of your positive comments about it, several years ago). I suspect on the stereos, the blue box may not be the ultimate but is a good solid way to get there without going crazy. The people on Hoffman rave about the 'tube cut' copies, which i gather sound warmer, but I have no real experience comparing them.
Some of your lack of enthusiasm, apart from pulling the most out of the groove using a mono set-up, may be the mix. I know some avid collectors who swear by the early monos as that was what the Beatles themselves focused on- at least through Sgt. Pepper, or the White Album. You may get more valid input from others who have deeper experience with original pressings, mono cuts or more knowledge of The Beatles recordings on vinyl in general. I'll send you a PM, because there is a little irony in this for me.

[mep]

Sounds like your neighbor was comparing mono vs. mono and he thought the Mono Box collection was "very close?" I'm staking out a position for the here and now that the stereo LPs sound better and more lifelike than the new Mono collection and I have given one example that people who own both LPs can compare for themselves. I am open to the possibility that my position could change after hearing the Mono collection played back with a mono cartridge.

[Bill Hart]

Sounds like your neighbor was comparing mono vs. mono and he thought the Mono Box collection was "very close?"

Yes. The guy has an amazing collection. It should probably be in the Library at some point. Really impressive-original Zombies stuff (Odyssey and Oracle first pressings are nutty money), old '78s that are perfect- he has a good older audiophile system, but is more of a record collector than an audiophile in the sense of the people here.

[mep]

Yes. The guy has an amazing collection. It should probably be in the Library at some point. Really impressive-original Zombies stuff (Odyssey and Oracle first pressings are nutty money), old '78s that are perfect- he has a good older audiophile system, but is more of a record collector than an audiophile in the sense of the people here.

I love the Zombies and I'm disappointed to say I have none of their LPs. I would love to have any of them that are well recorded. Sounds like your neighbor is more sane than the rest of us. He has a really good system and is more concerned with listening to LPs than he is with neurosing over the constant need to improve his system.

[Johnny Vinyl]

I've not sat down to compare the BC13 vs MONO albums, so I can't provide my own personal opinion. I don't favour one over the other and am almost inclined to keep it that way by not doing a direct comparison. It would be nice to have a second table with a mono cartridge, but I don't have enough mono pressings to really justify it.

[mep]

Well Johnny, the truth is always the truth. If I play something from the Mono Box and my brain starts telling me something is amiss based on the reference that is engraved in my brain cells, it's hard to ignore. Pulling out your reference and playing it quickly tells you the truth. Whether we like the truth is another subject. I'm glad I purchased the Mono collection. I appreciate the work that went into it and it looks cool in my room. Barring some revelation(s) from listening to the LPs through a mono cartridge, the Mono collection does not represent the best sound that I have available from Beatles LPs in my collection. I may be on a deserted island with my findings, but I have to tell the truth as I hear it.

[Mike Lavigne]

I have a few original Beatles monos and a mono cartridge. the box is very good and more neutral and detailed than the originals while the box set lacks a bit of body and heft relative to the original monos I have. preference over the originals would be based on personal taste. more expensive and time consuming to find good originals. I have not played this set for maybe 6 months. I did prefer the mono cartridge compared to my MC Anna stereo cartridge with the box set.

if I did not have the Mono Box I would still go out and buy it. it is done right and overall a real positive for any vinyl loving Beatles fan.

none of the mono's are in the league of my stereo master tape dubs but neither are my stereo original pressings either.

[mep]

I have a few original Beatles monos and a mono cartridge. the box is very good and more neutral and detailed than the originals while the box set lacks a bit of body and heft relative to the original monos I have. preference over the originals would be based on personal taste. more expensive and time consuming to find good originals. I have not played this set for maybe 6 months. I did prefer the mono cartridge compared to my MC Anna stereo cartridge with the box set.

if I did not have the Mono Box I would still go out and buy it. it is done right and overall a real positive for any vinyl loving Beatles fan.

none of the mono's are in the league of my stereo master tape dubs but neither are my stereo original pressings either.

Leaving tape aside for the here and now, I'm more interested in a sound comparison of the Mono Box set to the EMI Parlaphone stereo LPs than I am of a mono vs. mono comparison. If you have an early stereo copy of Beatles for Sale, play Every Little Thing and then play the mono version and tell which is better.

Back to tapes-Do you have EMI Parlaphone dubs or do you have Capitol dubs? I have heard numerous Beatle tapes at shows that never impressed me and I heard a Capitol tape in my room. The Capitol tape stunk my room out. I had to call an exterminator to get the smell out and an exorcist to get rid of the tape. I would love to hear a real, no BS dub of an EMI Parlaphone master tape in my room (or at least a third cousin twice removed) as it should be something special. Barring that scenario, the closest we can come to the truth is hearing early LPs that were made from fresh master tapes straight from the vaults.

[Bill Hart]

I love the Zombies and I'm disappointed to say I have none of their LPs. I would love to have any of them that are well recorded. Sounds like your neighbor is more sane than the rest of us. He has a really good system and is more concerned with listening to LPs than he is with neurosing over the constant need to improve his system.

There's a really old Rhino of O& O that isn't bad and should be reasonable money. The "Time of" comp at least the later US Epic( black label with script), is pretty lackluster, maybe an early orange Epic or UK is better for that.

[Johnny Vinyl]

Well Johnny, the truth is always the truth. If I play something from the Mono Box and my brain starts telling me something is amiss based on the reference that is engraved in my brain cells, it's hard to ignore. Pulling out your reference and playing it quickly tells you the truth. Whether we like the truth is another subject. I'm glad I purchased the Mono collection. I appreciate the work that went into it and it looks cool in my room. Barring some revelation(s) from listening to the LPs through a mono cartridge, the Mono collection does not represent the best sound that I have available from Beatles LPs in my collection. I may be on a deserted island with my findings, but I have to tell the truth as I hear it.

Yes! But you have to know what the truth is before you can claim it as such. Your truth with regard to the comparison is but a subjective opinion.

I'm a big Beatles fan, but not to the extent you and others perhaps are. As such, I'm not inclined to seek out or declare if mono or stereo is my truth. Listening sessions with both fully engage me equally and that's fine for me. The BC13 and Mono boxsets are probably the best Beatles pressings I will ever own and I would like to enjoy them both.