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  • #16
    Hi Joe and glad you joined our community!



    I wish I had read some of your insights before I installed my outlets!

    Truth be told, I wish AC receptacles didn't make a difference. I wish a lot of things didn't make a difference too! But not only do the Furutechs improve the sound but the sonic improvement can be on the order of a component. Or getting everything out of the component that you paid good money for. I feel that that connection is out of all the connections in the audio system, the most prone to dirt, etc. and affecting the sound. Now while the new NCF outlet is better than the older GTX-D Au outlets, but I'd say the difference is bigger between an ordinary outlet and the Furutech receptacle.

    While you may be speculating on some readings, the unavoidable evidence is that cheap outlets become arced, corroded and pitted and offer additional electrical problems. That is why I suggest that audiophiles, especially in older homes or apartments, change their AC connections. Whether its using the less expensive Porter Ports or the more expensive Furutechs. I had some some receptacles so degraded that they literally crumbled in my hand upon extraction from the wall.

    As to what is the best AC receptacle on the market, that's a hard comparison to do. It's impossible to do direct switching comparisons because every time you shut down a components--even if warmed up--it still takes at least a half hour for it to come back to sounding its best. I still have the older Ag Furutech in on position so will at least be able to do some sort of comparison. But I do know what when I have some free cash, I want to change the connectors on my Silver Circle PLC. In fact, it was David Stanard of Silver Circle who turned me onto the Furutechs because to my knowledge, he was the first to use them. And I think all of his new PLCs will incorporate the new NCF outlets.

    Have you ever tried some the AC boxes and/or Furutech covers with the outlets?
    Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
    Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
    ________________________________________

    -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
    -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
    -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
    -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
    -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
    -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
    -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
    -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
    -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
    -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

    Comment


    • #17
      Myles, I have used wall plate and covers for many years now. I first used stainless steel covers, then the stainless steel covers damped with Dynamat and ERS fabric, then Oyaide WPC-Z and now Furutech GTX wall plate with 104-D covers. I make a 4 outlet power strip I call the "QUAD" using the GTX-D NCF and wall plate/cover, which sounds really good. The picture shows my current power cables for the amplifiers in my Room 1 Reference System.
      Speakers/Amps: Genesis G2.2 Jr with Powered Servo-Sub Bass, Genesis GR1440 Mono Amps, 5,000 watts total power
      Preamp: SMc Audio VRE-1C Preamp (balanced)
      Table 1: VPI Prime Signature Belt-Drive Turntable with 10” 3D Printed Uni-pivot Arm and Modified Denon A100 MC Phono Cartridge driving Genesis Gold Phono Preamplifier
      Table 2: VPI HW-40 Direct-Drive Turntable with 12” 3D Printed Fat Boy Gimbal Arm and Ortofon MC Anna Diamond Phono Cartridge driving Genesis Platinum Phono Preamplifier
      R2R Tape: Studer A810 with Bridge Console
      Digital: Battery Powered Laptop running software on SSD, Music Files on USB SSD, and playback by JRMC. USB interface to M2Tech Young DAC
      Cables: Genesis Advanced Technologies/Absolute Fidelity Interface Interconnects, Speaker, Phono and Power
      Accessories: Furutech NCF receptacles, IsoTek Super Titan Passive Power Conditioning and Custom Acrylic Equipment Stands

      Comment


      • #18
        Back when my wife and I purchased our home you could actually call the utility companies and reach an engineer. When I added on the photo studio, along with it’s need for separate AC and heat, it required multiple dedicated lines to support both quartz and strobe lighting as well as traditional light fixtures and switches.

        I talked TXU Electric into replacing transformers in our alley and doing a dedicated double zero run to our home. This is basically commercial service and we wound up with a 750A three phase service plus trans socket meter. For those unfamiliar, a trans socket meter does not divert your power through the traditional meter network, but rather has straight rods the electricity passes though and a clamp system reads power much like an Amprobe would.

        With commercial drop and 750 amp service my outside panel is about 20 times the size of a normal neighborhood service panel and provides service for our air conditioners at reduced electrical rate and separates the power to my stereo.

        I have three breaker boxes, two that are 100 amp and one that’s 50 amp. The 50 amp is 220V only and provides three dedicated runs via special outlets so I can listen to European electronics at their native voltage. The two 100 watt panels provide 14 additional dedicated runs so each piece of stereo gear has it’s own run (if need).

        I have a choice of phase one or phase two and outlets are marked as such. Sometimes there is an advantage in running digital on separate phase than analog equipment (but not always).

        I use unplated, cryo treated Hubbell hospital grade outlets and nylon cover plates.

        I spent about $3600.00 doing this and it was one of the biggest upgrades I’ve even done, certainly near the top for money spent. I did not use special panels other than commercial Square D brand that have copper parts and copper buss. Also chose model with bolt in breakers that have torque specification. I treated all the contact areas with Deoxit and made sure the electrician torqued to specification listed on the panel.

        This was a very early decision and I think played a huge role in choices I made in electronics for all the years that followed.

        Comment


        • garylkoh
          garylkoh commented
          Editing a comment
          Albert, would you care to talk about the hospital-grade isolation transformer you used? I recall discussing this with you years ago, and you mentioned a name of one that worked very well for you.

      • #19
        Originally posted by Albert Porter View Post
        Back when my wife and I purchased our home you could actually call the utility companies and reach an engineer. When I added on the photo studio, along with it’s need for separate AC and heat, it required multiple dedicated lines to support both quartz and strobe lighting as well as traditional light fixtures and switches.

        I talked TXU Electric into replacing transformers in our alley and doing a dedicated double zero run to our home. This is basically commercial service and we wound up with a 750A three phase service plus trans socket meter. For those unfamiliar, a trans socket meter does not divert your power through the traditional meter network, but rather has straight rods the electricity passes though and a clamp system reads power much like an Amprobe would.

        With commercial drop and 750 amp service my outside panel is about 20 times the size of a normal neighborhood service panel and provides service for our air conditioners at reduced electrical rate and separates the power to my stereo.

        I have three breaker boxes, two that are 100 amp and one that’s 50 amp. The 50 amp is 220V only and provides three dedicated runs via special outlets so I can listen to European electronics at their native voltage. The two 100 watt panels provide 14 additional dedicated runs so each piece of stereo gear has it’s own run (if need).

        I have a choice of phase one or phase two and outlets are marked as such. Sometimes there is an advantage in running digital on separate phase than analog equipment (but not always).

        I use unplated, cryo treated Hubbell hospital grade outlets and nylon cover plates.

        I spent about $3600.00 doing this and it was one of the biggest upgrades I’ve even done, certainly near the top for money spent. I did not use special panels other than commercial Square D brand that have copper parts and copper buss. Also chose model with bolt in breakers that have torque specification. I treated all the contact areas with Deoxit and made sure the electrician torqued to specification listed on the panel.

        This was a very early decision and I think played a huge role in choices I made in electronics for all the years that followed.
        Great post!

        Glad to have you as part of our audio club Albert!

        Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
        Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
        ________________________________________

        -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
        -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
        -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
        -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
        -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
        -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
        -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
        -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
        -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
        -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

        Comment


        • #20
          Originally posted by cpp View Post
          2 New panels,, The electrician had to rebuild one service panel $1250) including some new runs. dedicated 20 amp service to two listening areas, and the power company using a megger identified a weak ground and added 10 additional feet of ground rod, .Added,whole house surge protection, whole house backup gen. Central Fla is a killer for lightning storms and power interruptions.
          Thanks Chris. I was going to start a thread on electrical panels, Equi-tech, etc. So I hope you don't mind me using your post to begin the thread.
          Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
          Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
          ________________________________________

          -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
          -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
          -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
          -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
          -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
          -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
          -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
          -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
          -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
          -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

          Comment


          • cpp
            cpp commented
            Editing a comment
            Sure, have at it.

        • #21
          Lately I've been experimenting with electrical. Someone suggested I try removing my Shunyata stuff (which consist of all Zitron power cords and a Typhon for the sources).


          It's incredible how much toying with electrical delivery changes the sound. My Shunyata Zitrons and Typhon definitely alter the tonal balance. However, I also have isolation transformers behind my outlets and they do something very similar.

          Lately I tried plugging my preamp and source into the outlets I used to use before I had the Equitech transformers installed. These old outlets were hospital grade outlets but they are on the same 15amp circuit that the entire room is on (i.e. anything plugged into any other outlet in the room PLUS the lighting - including dimmers, are all contributing to noise, etc.).

          All of this filtering seems to recess the midrange. Images become sharper and smaller (like an image coming into focus) but lose weight and don't sound as natural as I would like them to. On the other hand, the bass becomes very tight, quick, dry and deep. The highs seem more extended, although a bit dry.

          If I switch just my preamp over to the non-dedicated 15 amp circuit, the midrange blooms in size a bit but sounds more natural to my ears. Unfortunately the highs aren't as extended, deep bass is absent and the system slows down somewhat. It wouldn't say it becomes syrupy, but it is a bit reminiscent of the typical tube sound - like I switched from a solid state preamp to a tubed preamp.

          I also suspect the instruments aren't quite as separated. However, this said, I am really enjoying the sound. Listening to a jazz trio is mesmerizing to me as the piano sound so engaging. Classical also seems to have more beauty - the midrange is just so compelling.

          Swapping the shunyata power cable for a non-Shunyata changes the sound again, bringing back a bit of the rhythm and some of the deeper bass.

          My next step is to adjust my speaker positioning a bit: currently I have the right speaker just close enough to the right wall to pick up some reinforcement (my attempts to add more weight to the midrange) which I don't need with this 'tube' preamp. I might pick up some speed, reduce the mud without thinning out the midrange.

          Of course I might just get tired of this new sound due to its sins, but it's certainly fun to be able to have this change.

          Incidentally, having my preamp AND Typhon plugged into the non-dedicated circuit gets me close to the presentation of the preamp plugged into the equitech outlets (providing I've had the Typon plugged in for 16-24 hours or so).

          Fascinating stuff.
          Magico M-Project, CAT JL7SE, CH Precision L1/X1/P1, Kronos Pro Limited Edition/SME 3012R/Atlas SL/Opus-1, Schiit Yggdrasil, ZenWave D4 ICs & SCs

          Comment


          • MylesBAstor
            MylesBAstor commented
            Editing a comment
            My head is spinning!

          • MylesBAstor
            MylesBAstor commented
            Editing a comment
            Now I am trying to digest everything.

        • #22
          Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post

          Thanks Chris. I was going to start a thread on electrical panels, Equi-tech, etc. So I hope you don't mind me using your post to begin the thread.
          Or battery panel, like from Tesla?! :-)


          http://money.cnn.com/video/technolog...tery.cnnmoney/
          Last edited by allenh; 06-02-2016, 08:57 PM.
          Kronos Sparta -> Trinity Phono -> Trinity Pre -> CH Precision A1 -> Magico S7s

          Comment


          • cpp
            cpp commented
            Editing a comment
            With that product you will need solar if I read the product writeup on the Tesla site correctly. I think I will stick to clean power coming into the home, a good ground and backup protection.

        • #23
          A little AC line humor this morning!

          Click image for larger version

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ID:	17870
          Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
          Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
          ________________________________________

          -Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers with SPod feet
          -Goldmund Telos 280 stereo amp
          -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
          -Doshi V3.0 phonostage
          -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
          -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
          -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
          -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
          -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
          -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

          Comment


          • #24
            There is A very big PC no one is posting about , grounding and how to do it without creating ground loops meaning a ground path in more than one path . Part of this is an isolated hospital grade outlets . A hospital grade outlet is what everyone of the audio grade outlets are . Hubble , pass and see more or who ever . The meter pan described uses a current transformer . All meters do this but the 200 amp and less use a much smaller bar that has a ooil rapped around it . There are some meters that have remote reading capability these can and do emit noise . Also no matter how big ones service is it matters who else is on it. Most all of our uses create noise back on the line escecially switching pau,s . Fuses drives me crazy but I do admit there can be improvment . But what I do not read is simply enlarging the amp size of it. Large Amps mostly have fast acting large capacity fuses. So How or why it makes an improvement I have no answer. But for the small preamps enlarging the fuse size does make an improvement . I think that it's simply less resistance Ina larger fuse . What I would like is some posts of how the grounding is done ground loops do not just cause hum . For me I like a REGEn , but I do admit in sme cases they are not needed . Useing the same phase is a good idea , increasing the size of the breaker capacity is too. For me I use 50 amp circuit breakers and ten gauge wire to the 20 amp isolated hospital grade outlets . Th ground is one single 6 gauge wire looped to all of the 6 circuits used . A copper bus does have a bit less resistance but we are taking about mili ohms less as the size of,the buss is rated by its resistance . A bolt on panel sounds like a great idea . But we must understand all of our electrical connections rely on pressure to move the electrical force back and forth . Crimps mantain a better connection then the wire nuts or screw terminals As for the conductive paste that sounds good to me too although I do not use it. Installing a 200 amp busses panel on a 100 amp feeder will,beat out a copper bus of a 100 amp panel for sure and its legal to,use .
            I tried my woofer columns on the ps audio p10 and direct to the outlets I cannot say I hear an improvment either way . But my room is not done being balanced out so maybe it will some day lol. Lampi. Makes a product called a silk its not ul approved but it does work . It's pretty smiple too
            it has 5 outlets on the rear and switches on the front . It changes the polarity of each outlet seperatly . The theory is the windings of each of the power transformers of our devices maybe wound differently as there is no standard to making them. It's simplest way to explain is left to right or right to left . By moving the switches up or down you stop when it sounds best . Sounds crazy right but wall plates does to me hahahahaha .
            Lastly I am an agnostic in nature but I do very much admit that with many people I truly trust there must be much more to this topic . In a way I am glad I don't completely agree it save me plenty of money.
            Oh one last thought I use a ps audio P5 for video , this is somthing i can see from across the room it increases clarity as it obviously is reducing noise . For this reason I use two P5 and two P10 on my system. I have yet to see a power cord or fuse Inprove any of my video setups. But I do read of some who claim they do.
            analog stuff.
            otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
            otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
            sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
            new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
            thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
            thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
            kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
            phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
            speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
            mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
            digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
            Dacs lampi various

            Comment


            • MylesBAstor
              MylesBAstor commented
              Editing a comment
              Thanks Al! That was really interesting!

          • #25
            I never claim to know everything, and also a proponent to go back and refresh various subjects. Not only seeking great sound, but also the work to maintain it keeps the music sounding good!

            In this case of power, I added a third circuit but forgot about the phase. After reading the article https://www.msbtechnology.com/faq/how-to-wire-your-house-for-good-power/ and speaking with KingRex (Thank you), I quickly got things squared away.

            Enjoy Your Sound!
            Source Analog: Kuzma Stabi R with 4point 9 arm & Kuzma 40 Cartridge
            Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
            Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum Pre Amp and Monos | Boulder Phono 508
            Speakers: Wilson Alexias
            Cabling: Nordost Valhalla 2/Odin: power, interconnects & speaker | Ansuz: C2 power & interconnect | Audioquest Diamond RJ45’s
            Power: Nordost QRT series | Furutech FP55SN cable from 20 Amp Breakers on grounded sub panel to Furutech GTX D NSF receptacle packages | Surge Guard at Main Panel | Keces P3 & P8 | ADD POWR series
            Other: HRS M3X | Stillpoints Ultra 6, SS & Mini | Nordost Sort Cones TC & BC | AQ Vox SE switch | Gigafoil v4 | Vicoustics | Audio Desk Systeme - Gläss

            Comment


            • #26
              I have had the fortune ow wiring a few systems now. A lot of confusion surrounds how to wire a system. A good part of this is each system wants what it wants. No topology fits all.

              Having said that. Proper grounding is critical. How you build out the panel interior is also critical.
              PAP Trio 15 Horn speakers, Audion Black Shadow monoblocks, First Sound Audio Mark 3SI Paramount preamp,
              Mojo Audio Deja Vu server, Mojo Audio Mystique V3 DAC, STST Motus II TT, Vertere SG1 arm, Hanna ML, Allnic H1201 Phono pre, The Linear Solution Ethernet Switch, LPS to Modem Router and Switch, Blue Jeans Ethernet cabling throughout network, Akiko Corelli, Custom power strip direct wired to panel with OFC copper wire.10 awg dedicated branch circuits to amps bolted to power cords. Significant upgrades to 120 volt main power panel. Inakustik Ref Air 2404 Speaker cable. Genesis and Inakustik NF2404 Air Interconnects. ADDPower Symphony and Electraclear.

              Comment

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