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  • Tube Damping Rings

    In the process of experimenting with some simple silicon tube damping rings on the Doshi tapestage. Now damped all eight tubes so can't say if ECC99s or 12AT7s or both tube types that are at fault. Have to say at first blush is a big improvement. Better mids, depth, imaging and harmonic overtones. Still neutral with a side order of soul. Maybe a smidge softer.

    Obviously results are variable depending on tube type, manufacturer, tube sockets and treatment, circuit board isolation, etc and I've had many tube dampers destroy the sound. Take the Duende. Made everything sound like bad transistor design.

    Next to experiment with phonostage.
    Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
    Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
    ________________________________________

    -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
    -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
    -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
    -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
    -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
    -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
    -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
    -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
    -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
    -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

  • #2
    Some vendors, eg C-J and ARC, supply them with their products. I use Herbies on the solo tube in each of my Lamm monoblocks. And yes I've found it is possible to overdamp leading to less clarity, and less energy/enthusiasm that rounds off leading edges and dulls higher frequencies.

    Comment


    • #3
      At one point, when I was still using the ARC SP-10 mk ii, which was notorious for bringing out the worst in the tubes, crazy microphonics, I gave up on the tube rings and as an experiment, bought a whole set of those soft gel type tube mounts-- this was so long ago, I can't remember the brand. (I think they were pretty new as a concept at the time, but may be wrong). ARC at that time was happy to install them for me- but they didn't cure the problem as I recall, so I sent the unit back to ARC again, and had them reinstall factory tube mounts. That preamp, glorious in its day, was very tricky to get right.
      Allnic appears to have perfected the gel mount-- I did get some microphonics early on, but the combo of the gel mounts, plus the rings, and some judicious tube swapping, has made it a non-issue. I should try it at some point without the factory rings, i think they are still on the tubes.

      Comment


      • #4
        what about tube shields (cans) ? I put a set of these, all connected to chassis ground on my preamp tubes. Thought it might lower noise, didn't seem to do any harm although I cant really hear any improvement either.
        Magnepan 1.6 QR Loudspeakers, Amherst A-2000 MOSFET 150 WPC Amp, Conrad Johnson PV-10A Modded Tube Line & Phono Stage, Electrocompaniet MC II Class A Head Amp, Audio Technica AT-OC9XML Cart (Stereo) , Graham Engineering 2.2 Tonearm (Stereo) , VPI Aries-1 Turntable (Stereo) , VPI Clamp, Denon DL-102 Cart, (Mono) , Luxman Tonearm (Mono) , Kenwood KD-500 Turntable (Mono) , Michell Clamp, Marantz 20B Analog FM Tuner, Pioneer SACD, Onkyo DX-6800 CD Transport, DIY 24B/192K DAC, Sennheiser HD-650 Headphones, Headroom Max Balanced Headphone Amp, DIY Silver Interconnects

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by JCOConnell View Post
          what about tube shields (cans) ? I put a set of these, all connected to chassis ground on my preamp tubes. Thought it might lower noise, didn't seem to do any harm although I cant really hear any improvement either.
          Years ago tried as suggested by Ken Steven to make Al foil "tents" around the small signal tubes in the amplifier. That seemed to make a small difference but always worried that it also cooked the tubes at the same time. Companies such as Bottlehead still use tube cans. The rationale is that the tubes can act as antennas and pick up RFI.
          Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
          Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
          ________________________________________

          -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
          -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
          -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
          -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
          -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
          -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
          -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
          -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
          -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
          -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Bill Hart View Post
            At one point, when I was still using the ARC SP-10 mk ii, which was notorious for bringing out the worst in the tubes, crazy microphonics, I gave up on the tube rings and as an experiment, bought a whole set of those soft gel type tube mounts-- this was so long ago, I can't remember the brand. (I think they were pretty new as a concept at the time, but may be wrong). ARC at that time was happy to install them for me- but they didn't cure the problem as I recall, so I sent the unit back to ARC again, and had them reinstall factory tube mounts. That preamp, glorious in its day, was very tricky to get right.
            Allnic appears to have perfected the gel mount-- I did get some microphonics early on, but the combo of the gel mounts, plus the rings, and some judicious tube swapping, has made it a non-issue. I should try it at some point without the factory rings, i think they are still on the tubes.
            Yes everybody that I knew with the old SP10 had nightmares about tubes in that unit. They were 6DJ8s IIRC?
            Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
            Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
            ________________________________________

            -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
            -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
            -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
            -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
            -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
            -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
            -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
            -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
            -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
            -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by tima View Post
              Some vendors, eg C-J and ARC, supply them with their products. I use Herbies on the solo tube in each of my Lamm monoblocks. And yes I've found it is possible to overdamp leading to less clarity, and less energy/enthusiasm that rounds off leading edges and dulls higher frequencies.
              I've tried a lot of different tube dampers over the years. So many can't remember them old. The old Sicomin (wish still had them because would like to try again). AudioQuest sorbothane. Tube sox. The metal pieces from Andy Bowman that glued on top of the small signal tubes. The Shun Mook wood resonators. The newer Duende. EAT tube coolers. The Pearl Tube coolers (one of the worst sounding).

              The AQ were the worst but not necessarily because of the sound. The suckers melted and dripped down the tube. It was a beast then getting that melted sorbothane off the tube! Ughhh!
              Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
              Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
              ________________________________________

              -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
              -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
              -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
              -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
              -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
              -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
              -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
              -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
              -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
              -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

              Comment


              • timztunz
                timztunz commented
                Editing a comment
                Myles, can you comment on the Shun Mook tube resonators? I'm tempted and curious about them.

              • MylesBAstor
                MylesBAstor commented
                Editing a comment
                It's been a long time. Long time. My general memory with this SM accessory as with their other products is they are great if you like that sound. I don't consider them neutral devices. They have a flavor. But who knows nowadays?

            • #8
              Another short update. Did a little listening to tape last night and have to say that the tube dampers truly elevated the sound of the front-end. Listened to the AS Scheherazade again for the review I'm doing and it's almost a totally different tape. Take what was a good tape to a reference tape. Violin solo tone is now simply mouth watering (before was just a little edgy like heard on the reissued LP) but not syrupy sweet. Dimensionality and separation of instruments are markedly improved, and low end is more extended and tighter. There's also just a little bit more low level information coming through the speakers too. The violin/harp duet = Scheherazade has never been better. Each instrument really occupies their own space and the two just sing to each other. What a wonderful performance and recording.
              Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
              Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
              ________________________________________

              -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
              -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
              -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
              -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
              -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
              -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
              -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
              -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
              -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
              -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

              Comment


              • #9
                While I don't have any where the tube experience as most here do. I do have a perspective I think most don't.
                One is the many tube rolls of my dac and the other is headphones. While speakers do give the ultimate sound , great headphones yield details that one must look for in speakers while headphones scream at you this change.
                Tube microphones I think come from three places
                one is room sounds if loud enough it can degrade the sound

                tube rings help or even an open top heaven glass does.
                the metal ones never helped in microphonics but do lower noise floor in shielding

                next is the tube itself creating the vibrations inside
                this tube rings help but a globe design seems a best fix for both issues above and putting rings can help further

                lastly what I don't see posted is gain having more stages of less gain helps. I don't design and don't know why
                but owning many lampi dacs some tubes are much more louder in this than others. The cure for me is a passive preamp after the dac. I don't know why but it fixes it.
                I guess it's an imp matching thing.
                My woo WA5 has three imp output settings on it.
                Pick the wrong one for a set of headphones makes for extreme microphonics. Like just one finger gently closing accross the amp is loud.
                analog stuff.
                otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
                otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
                sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
                new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
                thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
                thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
                kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
                phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
                speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
                mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
                digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
                Dacs lampi various

                Comment


                • MylesBAstor
                  MylesBAstor commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Thanks Al for the different perspective. Agree on metal ones.

              • #10
                Originally posted by Alrainbow View Post
                While I don't have any where the tube experience as most here do. I do have a perspective I think most don't.
                One is the many tube rolls of my dac and the other is headphones. While speakers do give the ultimate sound , great headphones yield details that one must look for in speakers while headphones scream at you this change.
                Tube microphones I think come from three places
                one is room sounds if loud enough it can degrade the sound

                tube rings help or even an open top heaven glass does.
                the metal ones never helped in microphonics but do lower noise floor in shielding

                next is the tube itself creating the vibrations inside
                this tube rings help but a globe design seems a best fix for both issues above and putting rings can help further

                lastly what I don't see posted is gain having more stages of less gain helps. I don't design and don't know why
                but owning many lampi dacs some tubes are much more louder in this than others. The cure for me is a passive preamp after the dac. I don't know why but it fixes it.
                I guess it's an imp matching thing.
                My woo WA5 has three imp output settings on it.
                Pick the wrong one for a set of headphones makes for extreme microphonics. Like just one finger gently closing accross the amp is loud.
                Alrainbow,
                I am trying to get in touch with you please check your messages and get back to me...

                Comment


                • #11
                  Hahaha I see that. You can email me at [email protected]
                  analog stuff.
                  otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
                  otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
                  sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
                  new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
                  thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
                  thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
                  kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
                  phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
                  speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
                  mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
                  digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
                  Dacs lampi various

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    I use Herbie's tube dampers. I fit them high on the tube on the getter line. Can overdamp if fitted lower on the body. I think they lower the noise floor allowing for a better sense of resolution. I have used them for more than 10,000 hours even on TFK ECC801S & ECC803S without any adversities.
                    Steve

                    Studer Enthusiast

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      Does anyone have experience on globes over bottles in sound ?
                      analog stuff.
                      otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
                      otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
                      sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
                      new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
                      thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
                      thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
                      kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
                      phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
                      speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
                      mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
                      digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
                      Dacs lampi various

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        I recall someone making a sleeve of sorts that slide over tubes... Ensemble?
                        Dave Clark
                        Editor and Publisher, Positive Feedback
                        www.positive-feedback.com

                        Comment


                        • #15
                          http://herbiesaudiolab.net/compare.htm
                          Dave Clark
                          Editor and Publisher, Positive Feedback
                          www.positive-feedback.com

                          Comment

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