Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Problem with ground hum with Miyajima Labs Zero

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Problem with ground hum with Miyajima Labs Zero

    Hoping to get some seasoned advice here.

    An age old analog problem and I’m a new victim. To preface, I have an Aesthetix Rhea Signature phonostage with single-ended phono imputs and no mono button on my preamp.

    So, with little research of possible compatibility issues I recently and enthusiastically went for a Miyajima Labs Zero (mono) to hopefully enjoy all the positive sonic attributes that have been spoken of and unknowingly got myself caught up in a quagmire with an intolerable ground loop hum. I can honestly say that I have never had a real issue with pesky ground loops fortunately, so I’m at a bit of a lose to understand how to deal with this...

    If I understand previous conversations and recommendations requiring the summing of the two pair of cartridge outputs to cancel the ground loop... couldn’t a possibly more eloquent and less signal intrusive alternative be employed than a (summing Y adapter) and (splitting Y adapter) scenario using IC’s and multiple connection points with RCA plugs and sockets? Because like many of us, I find this a huge potential sonic disadvantage.

    Couldn't we simply employ very short, very high quality cartridge jumper wires just after the cartridge pins, bare them midsection and twist paired conductors resulting in a summing of L/R (+) together and L/R (-) together, like so >-< from the cartridge to the tonearm wire and subsequently the phonostage?

    Wouldn’t this take care of a ground loop, and/or am I missing something?

    Thanks in advance 🎶
    Listening/Living room is 25.5x14.5x8.5, modestly live and dynamic, Brinkmann Balance w/RöNT II PS, HRS, Reed P3-12, Miyajima Zero, Avid Acutus SP, SME V w/Kondo fairy hair silver litz, Lyra Kleos, Linn Sondek LP12 w/Ittok LVII, Nakamichi ZX-7, Sony SCD-XA5400ES, Aesthetix Calypso & Rhea Signatures, Nordost TYR Norse 2 XLR IC, Silent Source Music Ref mains, Atma-Sphere MA1 Mk.3.4 OTL Silver Edition monoblocks, Elrod EPS-3 Sign power cables, Coincident Techn PREt, PS Audio Premiere, Yamamoto racks

  • #2
    I could be missing something here but if you're using a mono cart why do you need to "Y" anything? I use a Miyajima Zero on a second arm and connect the single ended phono cable connections directly to the phono stage as I would normally, just on a 2nd input.
    Horning Eufrodite Ellipse III Speakers - 300B Monoblocks - TW Acustic RLS-100 Line Stage - TW Acustic RPS-100 Phono Stage - TW Acustic Raven AC with (2) 10.5 Arms and Black Knight Anniversary Upgrades - Ortofon A-95 and Miyajima Zero - Playback Designs MP-5 to a Bricasti M1 DAC for SACD (DSD) and Redbook - Tascam 42B (Refurb by Soren Witrup) + Doshi V.3 Tape Stage - (2) Silver Circle Audio TCHAIK 6's - Furutech Power Cords & Interconnects + Inakustik LS-4004 Air Speaker Cables - VPI 16.5 RCM

    Comment


    • DetroitVinylRob
      DetroitVinylRob commented
      Editing a comment
      The Zero cartridge has four output pins, God knows why with (as I understand it) a single coil. Unlike say Lyra, etc who employ dual coils on their mono carts. Also, from what I gather, some preamps don’t seem to present with a hum and others do. Guess I just got “lucky”, mine does. Are you connecting to the phonostage with both pair of cartridge outputs?

    • timztunz
      timztunz commented
      Editing a comment
      Yes sir I am. I connected all four tonearm leads to the cartridge and then connected the single ended phono cable to Left and Right on the 2nd input (out of three available) on my phono stage.

    • DetroitVinylRob
      DetroitVinylRob commented
      Editing a comment
      Timztunz, it sounds like we have a very similar situation. Though something is different in execution

  • #3
    Some tonearms wiring reference ground in the arm. The latest Thoress phono manual goes over some mono setup & cautions. PDF available on line.

    Comment


    • Spla'nin
      Spla'nin commented
      Editing a comment
      Keep us posted as I would be interested in the outcome. Other mfgs like Boulder & BMC mcci are very specific about cabling / shielding / connections on phono inputs due to their individual topography. At the cartridge, coils are carrying signal on both leads (inherently balanced).

    • Spla'nin
      Spla'nin commented
      Editing a comment
      You may have already seen this .. Ibelchev writes what the Aesthetix manual shows for the Rhea connections.

      https://forum.audiogon.com/discussio...iyajima%2BZero

    • DetroitVinylRob
      DetroitVinylRob commented
      Editing a comment
      Yes Spla’nin, saw that thread and the older thread it references. Thanks

  • #4
    For what its worth I had a audible ground hum when connecting my TT into a system with a stereo cartridge. I took a stranded speaker wire folded one end over to it up double up and pushed it into the ground pin of the outlet. I took the other end of the wire stripped back and touched it to a metal section on the plinth and the hum was completely gone. If it works I can share with you what I made as the final wiring to make a ground. Also all that Y patch stuff makes no sense to me since the source is a mono recording therefore what travels down the L/R interconnects is mono in content.

    Comment


    • #5
      So, here is what I received to support my situation from the kind folks at Aesthetix...
      Mono Cartridge Connection.pdf

      and the Thoress info:
      thoeress_phono_enhancer_manual.pdf
      Attached Files
      Listening/Living room is 25.5x14.5x8.5, modestly live and dynamic, Brinkmann Balance w/RöNT II PS, HRS, Reed P3-12, Miyajima Zero, Avid Acutus SP, SME V w/Kondo fairy hair silver litz, Lyra Kleos, Linn Sondek LP12 w/Ittok LVII, Nakamichi ZX-7, Sony SCD-XA5400ES, Aesthetix Calypso & Rhea Signatures, Nordost TYR Norse 2 XLR IC, Silent Source Music Ref mains, Atma-Sphere MA1 Mk.3.4 OTL Silver Edition monoblocks, Elrod EPS-3 Sign power cables, Coincident Techn PREt, PS Audio Premiere, Yamamoto racks

      Comment


      • Spla'nin
        Spla'nin commented
        Editing a comment
        Rob, got it, thanks for the info. Is the Zero four prong or two prong on the output?

      • DetroitVinylRob
        DetroitVinylRob commented
        Editing a comment
        the Miyajima Zero mono is four prong.

      • Spla'nin
        Spla'nin commented
        Editing a comment
        We need to identify the two correct output pins as the manual identifies two possibilities . If you have a multimeter and are OK with using it in your setup, that is one way to find the approx. 6ohm coil. Another way is to call Bob of Bob's Devices at 910-612-8666 who's a Miyajima dealer for the prong pinouts.

    • #6
      So, another piece of the puzzle to mono play... who could imagine this would be such a (non-standard) unpredictable deal? The Miyajima Zero mono is internally bridged between pair of plus (+) and bridged between pair of minus (-) pins. It is a true single coil (Info from Robyatt Audio) with a pin take out of:

      Red right +
      Green right -
      White left +
      Blue left -

      *As I understand it, what is creating an issue of ground loop is the (-) from cartridge L/R bridged internally and with some modern phonostages doing the same, the (-) from L/R connected this creates a hum.
      Last edited by DetroitVinylRob; 03-17-2018, 02:45 PM. Reason: Corrected inaccuracy
      Listening/Living room is 25.5x14.5x8.5, modestly live and dynamic, Brinkmann Balance w/RöNT II PS, HRS, Reed P3-12, Miyajima Zero, Avid Acutus SP, SME V w/Kondo fairy hair silver litz, Lyra Kleos, Linn Sondek LP12 w/Ittok LVII, Nakamichi ZX-7, Sony SCD-XA5400ES, Aesthetix Calypso & Rhea Signatures, Nordost TYR Norse 2 XLR IC, Silent Source Music Ref mains, Atma-Sphere MA1 Mk.3.4 OTL Silver Edition monoblocks, Elrod EPS-3 Sign power cables, Coincident Techn PREt, PS Audio Premiere, Yamamoto racks

      Comment


      • Spla'nin
        Spla'nin commented
        Editing a comment
        So if that info is correct for the mono cart and comparing their info to the Aesthetix manual cart option - looks like the 'ace benz' orientation.

    • #7
      I agree Spla’nin, if I understand this correctly, it actually makes sense to me and I’m setting it up to test, as we speak.

      Here is what happened. Hooked up the mono rig to phonostage and preamp exactly like Glenn at Aesthetix shows in diagram, disregarding all else. Sound gorgeous, absolutely no hum (no ground loop), works just fine. Game over.

      Moral to story: 1. do our due diligence before we jump. 2. Would be great to get “all” operational instructions up front from manufacturers.

      Happy listening!
      Last edited by DetroitVinylRob; 03-17-2018, 06:00 PM. Reason: clarity
      Listening/Living room is 25.5x14.5x8.5, modestly live and dynamic, Brinkmann Balance w/RöNT II PS, HRS, Reed P3-12, Miyajima Zero, Avid Acutus SP, SME V w/Kondo fairy hair silver litz, Lyra Kleos, Linn Sondek LP12 w/Ittok LVII, Nakamichi ZX-7, Sony SCD-XA5400ES, Aesthetix Calypso & Rhea Signatures, Nordost TYR Norse 2 XLR IC, Silent Source Music Ref mains, Atma-Sphere MA1 Mk.3.4 OTL Silver Edition monoblocks, Elrod EPS-3 Sign power cables, Coincident Techn PREt, PS Audio Premiere, Yamamoto racks

      Comment


      • #8
        Awesome everything worked out Rob. Life is a process / adventure sometimes. Enjoy your music. I've been eyeballing this cart myself so I'm very glad to see your success.

        Comment

        Working...
        X