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  • How to deal with humming

    Well, i thought i had my hum issues under control. There back. Part of the culprit is my dimmers and refrigerator. Not wanting to impact my sonics, has anyone effectivly used a noise reducing product they install next to the power panel and route your home lighting, refrigerator or other noisy devices through. Why not filter my own garbage from feeding back into my panel. If so, what device have you found to effectively deal with dimmer and motor noise.
    Thanks
    PAP Trio 10/Voxativ & PAP Trio 15 Horn speakers, Ampsandsound Casablanca monoblocks, First Sound Audio Mark 3SI Paramount preamp,
    Mojo Audio Deja Vu server, Mojo Audio Mystique V3 DAC, The Linear Solution Ethernet Switch, Blue Jeans Ethernet cablling,
    Akiko Corelli, Custom power strip direct wired to panel with OFC copper wire. Inakustik Ref Air 2404 Speaker cable. Genesis and Inakustik NF2404 Air Interconnects. ADDPower Symphony and Electraclear.

  • #2
    Hard to believe you are the guy that wrote this on AS:

    ”You would be blessed to have me rebuild the power system in your listening room. I'm one of few who understand audio enough to ground, isolate, damp, employ high quality materials etc. I rock at powering an audio rack. Others do too, but good luck finding one unless you purchase a setup from a dealer like Mike and ask he provide a guy who does it right. I assume Mike has found one, and probably had to coach him to get the install where Mike was satisfied. And he wont be inexpensive. You pay for the level of detail I bring.”

    https://www.audioshark.org/general-o...800-page2.html

    post #18

    Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

    Comment


    • Rob
      Rob commented
      Editing a comment
      MEP, If Pesci does not reprise his role in the sequel to My Cousin Vinny, I think you're shoe in

    • mep
      mep commented
      Editing a comment
      Thanks Rob. Maybe I missed my calling.

  • #3
    A very simple way to absolutely fix hum in any system.

    disconnect the speakers.
    see it’s very simple lol.
    analog stuff.
    otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
    otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
    sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
    new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
    thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
    thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
    kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
    phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
    speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
    mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
    digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
    Dacs lampi various

    Comment


    • #4
      Originally posted by Kingrex View Post
      Well, i thought i had my hum issues under control. There back. Part of the culprit is my dimmers and refrigerator. Not wanting to impact my sonics, has anyone effectivly used a noise reducing product they install next to the power panel and route your home lighting, refrigerator or other noisy devices through. Why not filter my own garbage from feeding back into my panel. If so, what device have you found to effectively deal with dimmer and motor noise.
      Thanks
      Rex joking aside you need to make a diagram
      all in your room
      all on power and network
      any and all devices in your room this means
      tv , all of your stereo, dimmers , routers , access points , repeaters , blue tooth and how you stack or have other items in close proximity to all of your stuff.
      once this is done you have a chance of not it’s just a game of shooting blind at flies .
      analog stuff.
      otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
      otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
      sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
      new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
      thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
      thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
      kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
      phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
      speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
      mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
      digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
      Dacs lampi various

      Comment


      • Kingrex
        Kingrex commented
        Editing a comment
        True, my friend Ultrafast said the same. Make a list. I laughed the other day when I told him turning off the amps got rid of all the hum. I was joking, but it does make the case that I hear no transformer noise from preamps, dac, server etc. They are all quiet.

        I changed out all my dimmers a few years ago to Lutron Maestro and that helped, but last night it was obvious not enough. I went around and turned them all off and it reduced a crackle riding on the hum, but the hum was there. What pisses me off is I can turn all my audio gear off and short the input on the amps and it still hums. All my equipment has ground lift switches. They do nothing. I even laced dead soft 20 awg silver wire from all the ground points on my gear to a heavy ofc chunk of copper I drilled and taped like a ground bar. No difference. I really don't think its a ground loop. I pulled my preamps power supplies out in front of the rack away from other gear. No change. I cut down some of my not so great power cables to lengths where they fit with no loops or paralleling other wires. No change. I plugged direct into the wall. No change.

        I could try turning off all my data equipment in the basement during the week when my wife is not home. They could be making pollution. I am going to purchase a PS Audio hum buster. I will run it in series with my lighting and any other home based noise makers I find offending my system. I hope that is a big plus for people who have dimmers. I will let all know if it works or not.

        I am thinking I also need to put my old tubes back in the amps. Who knows. I have had technicians tell me a tube that is not balanced can make humming in amps. I guess its a big issue with big bottle triode amps.

        I also need to put my iron core chokes back on my crossovers. I went to Jensen Air Core. Who knows, maybe they are acting as antenna.

        I contacted the Cable company. Rich with Shunyata keeps telling me to try his Noise Reducing cable. I am going to take 2 out on loan. Delta series. I don't want to spend the $ on Alpha. Now, if I do find the NR works wonders and does not impact sonics, I may get a single Sigma series and use it to feed my power strip. That way I get all my equipment off one nice cable.

        The big pisser is my setup was pretty darn quiet for about 6 month. Very little noise. Put your head by the speaker and you heard it, but not at the chair. The biggest changes I made recently was switching from iron to air chokes and replacing the kt88 with kt77. I will give that a shot this afternoon. One at a time, of course.

    • #5
      This is killing me. I got back home from a morning with my wife and the dog. I turn the stereo on and it super quiet. As little noise as on a good day. Its sunny out, 2:25 pm. I cant but think I have some sort of pollution from the mains. This is a scope reading from a day with medium noise. There are rags at the top and bottom of my sine wave and 1.92% distortion. I'm pretty darn confident its from the utility lines. They changed the transformer a year ago when they replaced my pole. That actually helped a little. The new transformer has a decent looking ground cable from it.

      The utility is not going to come and test anything and help poor olll me out with a noisy stereo. No one else in my neighborhood notices. For all intents and purpose, to the general user, we never loose power and have very few surges. We have pretty good power. Unless you have 96DB efficient speakers.
      PAP Trio 10/Voxativ & PAP Trio 15 Horn speakers, Ampsandsound Casablanca monoblocks, First Sound Audio Mark 3SI Paramount preamp,
      Mojo Audio Deja Vu server, Mojo Audio Mystique V3 DAC, The Linear Solution Ethernet Switch, Blue Jeans Ethernet cablling,
      Akiko Corelli, Custom power strip direct wired to panel with OFC copper wire. Inakustik Ref Air 2404 Speaker cable. Genesis and Inakustik NF2404 Air Interconnects. ADDPower Symphony and Electraclear.

      Comment


      • #6
        Since this is not a constant issue: do you have a portable heater in use anywhere? Just a thought.

        At my house we have an infra-red portable heater and that thing makes a huge amount of noise on the powerline....
        Regards,

        Erik
        http://solypsa.com
        North American distributor for:
        Sensitive Sound MC Cartridges
        STST Turntables + Tonearms


        Available for in home setup and calibration of fine turntable systems

        Comment


        • Kingrex
          Kingrex commented
          Editing a comment
          No space heaters. Gas powered liquid radiant floor heat. In the past I have turned off all circuits in my house accept for the audio and the hum did not change. But, I can tell the dimmers and refrigerator are causing some of the issues.

          FWIW, hum is back to medium levels this evening 4:45 pm. Baaaaa

      • #7
        Is it hum, buzz or noise that you are hearing? Or a mix of some or all? Hum is 60 Hz. Buzz is a multiple of 60Hz.. Noise is anything that is not hum or buzz. Reason I ask is because there are certain fixes for each.

        When the "noise" is present, is it present with any component in any configuration?

        Or only with certain sources, like only with turntable?
        -Tim Leinbaugh
        -Professional RTR restoration and modification for 45 years.
        [email protected]
        www.MusicTechnology.com

        Comment


        • Kingrex
          Kingrex commented
          Editing a comment
          Pretty confident its 60 cycle hum. The dimmers add a layer of buzz on top. The refer adds a modulating warble. Thats how Unidentified those items.

          You know whats weird about that corner of my house and room. Its like a dish for sound. It gathers in that side. If a bath fan, washer/dryer, refer is running, rhe sound build up and reverberates loud there. I wondered if RF also gathers there. Years back I drug my Rega Osiris to different rooms but the transformer in the unit hummed all over my house. Dead quiet at 1 friends place and 2 audio dealers stores.

          I should still build a shield and drop it over my amps for kicks. Who knows.

      • #8
        Rex I’m home sick again and do feel sorry for your issues. If you short the amps inputs and of it still Hums it’s the amps alone and i doubt its grounding but can’t say for sure.
        nas did dimmers stop looking at just them
        bulbs all kinds create noise. I’m saying it’s not obvious
        analog stuff.
        otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
        otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
        sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
        new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
        thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
        thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
        kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
        phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
        speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
        mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
        digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
        Dacs lampi various

        Comment


        • #9
          Rex amps have a much lower gain so while refi amd Emi still matter it’s far less.
          If you shunt the input to the amps does it hum. ???
          analog stuff.
          otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
          otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
          sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
          new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
          thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
          thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
          kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
          phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
          speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
          mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
          digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
          Dacs lampi various

          Comment


          • #10
            If you think the hum comes from grounding issues, use a cheater plug (a two-prong plug which disconnects the power ground) on each piece of equipment in turn to see where the ground loop is. Also, make sure the phase of the power plug is the same in each piece of equipment, because the neutral connection of the domestic single phase power supply is connected to ground. Plug in each piece of equipment in turn with the cheater plug, after disconnecting all the interconnects (otherwise it would be connected to the chassis ground of the other pieces of equipment). Measure the voltage between the chassis (you can probe a screw on the chassis) and the ground connection of the power socket which the equipment is plugged into. Then switch the polarity of the power plug around and measure again. The lower reading is the correct orientation. You might need to reinstall the plug to switch the polarity. This will make sure the power supply transformer of every piece of equipment is on the same phase. Alternatively, you can plug every piece of equipment into a balanced isolation transformer. This is the best way to isolate from the noise in the mains, but would not be suitable for high powered amplifiers.

            Comment


            • Kingrex
              Kingrex commented
              Editing a comment
              I have a 2.4 kva topaz .oo5pf line iso transformer. It use to work wel wilth my CJ. It did not work with my Altex. It has a slight damping of dynamics and extension. Not a lot. I was actually thinking of putting my lighting and refrigerator through the transformer if I could not find a humbuster. Fwiw, that transformers losses cost me $7 a month in utility fees.

              Per earlier, my gear all have ground lift switches. I dont need cheater plugs. I did try cheaters on the amps which dont have lift switches, no change.

              I don't really want to mess with flippimg the orientation of plugs. I will probe my cords again and pop the lid on my gear, but I'm a curious person and spent pleanty of time stairing at the electeonics in all my equipment. I'm 99.99% sure the makers of my gear did not screw up, and my cords dont have flipped polarity.

            • adrianwu
              adrianwu commented
              Editing a comment
              I have found the electrical polarity differ between different manufacturers, so it is worth checking. In some cases, the difference could be tens of volts, which would induce ground loops. This is something that could improve the sound quality while costing nothing.

          • #11
            Rex I just re read your comments of the amps inputs are shorted. It’s obvious to be them. Now turn off all stuff in the house. I know sounds crazy but all off of its gone out back one at a time. If it’s till there amps need service but I doubt both amps at the same time are bad.
            made these amps ss or tubes ? If tubes swap tubes even remove driver and input tubes leave output post results
            analog stuff.
            otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
            otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
            sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
            new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
            thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
            thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
            kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
            phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
            speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
            mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
            digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
            Dacs lampi various

            Comment


            • Kingrex
              Kingrex commented
              Editing a comment
              Thats my plan Al.

              By the way, my hum issues are nothing to be sorry about. Your health is so much more important. You have been a mentor to me in my digital journey. You really taught me the importance of good clean power, power supplies and software. Things other scoffed at for so long. I can't believe I have not made it out to NY to give your system a listen. Hopefully you stick around for a couple more years.

              Im going to try flipping breakers and see what pollution is internal to my house and filter those lines to domestic products.

              I am also gettknga jar of the contact cleaner Myles noted in another thread and I will clean all my power, pin and rca contacts. I have some tubes to try too. My driver tubes are pretty old nos jan phillips 6CA7 chrome tops. Maybe 4000 hours on them. Whats makes me doubt tube issues or contact issues is the noises is very consistent in tone and volume between the speakers. My system is very mono. My preamp has 2 power supplies and independent grounds etc in rhe case. My amps are monoblocks. A tube issue would probably manifest a little different between sides, but I will try.

          • #12
            Rex your looking for a ghost in the daylight
            you need to consider all ideas it’s all I’m saying here
            please make a log of each move it’s the only way to keep track of what’s moving you in the right direction. all I ever posted was factual confirmed by me. Having said this many cures or conclusions can be wrong even if it gets better.
            keep trying ok don’t give up but do play and enjoy the music too.
            analog stuff.
            otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
            otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
            sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
            new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
            thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
            thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
            kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
            phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
            speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
            mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
            digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
            Dacs lampi various

            Comment


            • #13
              As soon as I can get my hands on 4 shunyata defenders im going to try the following. Im going to put a 2 poll 20 amp breaker at the 1 and 3 positions in my panel. I will nipple a box to my panel, run 10 awg thwn and put 2 duplex outlets in the box. One on each phase with a shared neutral and ground. Then I will plug the 4 defenders into the sockets. Ultrafast said too many mess with the sound, yet they lower noise. Maybe they will be far enough from my audio branch circuit that they shunt the noise but leave the tone untouched in my audio. Worth a shot. I will report on results.

              fwiw, I tried putting my akiko corelli into my panel but it had no affect there. It seems to do something at my rack. Having said that, my nas at my rack into my audio branch circuit absolutly injects noise. In my server rack at the panel I don't hear it. Having 40 feet of cord between the 2 helps. They are both plugged into rhe same cb at the panel. All my gear is off 1 CB in my panel.
              PAP Trio 10/Voxativ & PAP Trio 15 Horn speakers, Ampsandsound Casablanca monoblocks, First Sound Audio Mark 3SI Paramount preamp,
              Mojo Audio Deja Vu server, Mojo Audio Mystique V3 DAC, The Linear Solution Ethernet Switch, Blue Jeans Ethernet cablling,
              Akiko Corelli, Custom power strip direct wired to panel with OFC copper wire. Inakustik Ref Air 2404 Speaker cable. Genesis and Inakustik NF2404 Air Interconnects. ADDPower Symphony and Electraclear.

              Comment


              • #14
                Rez go simple see why then look for a cure. you sound like me not on meds focus one item amps amps amps why they hum it's first on your to do list and enjoy some music too bro play loud enough have a glass of wine
                ok. If you have to call me ok.
                analog stuff.
                otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
                otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
                sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
                new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
                thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
                thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
                kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
                phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
                speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
                mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
                digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
                Dacs lampi various

                Comment


                • #15
                  I tried a line isolation transformer last night. Then had an engineer friend texting with me. Tried a bunch of things. Thought I was close. Found an issue between the preamp and amp that I thought was an issue (40% of probem). Then the issue juat went away. As in put back to stock and the issue was gone. So f up. Irregardless, I am suspect my damb expensive Inakustik interconnect (single ended)are not grounded at both ends. I was on the floor last night with poor light and a meter. Will try again today on a bench.

                  Yet, dont get all excited as in see its a ground loop. A shorted input at the amp and it still hums louder than acceptable. The interconnect might be a percentage piece of the puzzle.

                  FWIW. With the input to amp shorted. At night with worst power, the line iso transformer made about a 20% improvement. But, the tone changed. Got a little fatiguing and made me keep the volume 7.5db lower than normal.

                  lifting rhe internal ground switch on the preamp makes a small improvement when the system is connected complete.
                  PAP Trio 10/Voxativ & PAP Trio 15 Horn speakers, Ampsandsound Casablanca monoblocks, First Sound Audio Mark 3SI Paramount preamp,
                  Mojo Audio Deja Vu server, Mojo Audio Mystique V3 DAC, The Linear Solution Ethernet Switch, Blue Jeans Ethernet cablling,
                  Akiko Corelli, Custom power strip direct wired to panel with OFC copper wire. Inakustik Ref Air 2404 Speaker cable. Genesis and Inakustik NF2404 Air Interconnects. ADDPower Symphony and Electraclear.

                  Comment

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