Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

resale values

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • resale values

    this is almost too hard to watch, I think the seller slashed his price a few times: https://www.audiogon.com/listings/tu...-analog-680602

    What is the true used value of current high-end gear and is this a reflection of poor perceived value? there was a time, believe or not when dealers would buy gear off flippers just so it wouldn't impact the sale of new gear. I've been on audiogon almost since the beginning, back then 40% off for a current piece was fair, then 50% became the norm. this TechDas is closer to 65% off...wow.
    TechDAS | Graham Eng | ZYX | B.M.C. | Boulder | Magico

    "Listening to Analogue music is an act of rebellion in a digital gulag" - Simon Yorke

  • #2
    The sign of the apocalypse (AudiogeddoN).
    Last edited by Joe Pittman; 03-14-2017, 10:29 AM.
    Speakers/Amps: Genesis G2.2 Jr with Powered Servo-Sub Bass, Genesis GR1440 Mono Amps, 5,000 watts total power
    Preamp: SMc Audio VRE-1C Preamp (fully balanced inputs and output)
    Phono 1: VPI Signature 21 Belt-Drive Turntable with 10” 3D Printed Fatboy Gimbal Arm and Ortofon MC Windfeld Ti Phono Cartridge driving Lehmann Decade Phono Preamp
    Phono 2: VPI HW-40 Direct-Drive Turntable with 12” 3D Printed Fatboy Gimbal Arm and Ortofon MC Anna Diamond Phono Cartridge driving Genesis Gold Phono Preamp
    R2R Tape: Studer A810 with Bridge Console
    Digital: Lumin Network Player with Lumin NAS
    Cables: Genesis Advanced Technologies/Absolute Fidelity Interface Interconnects, Speaker, Phono and Power
    Power: Audio-Ultra Power System, IsoTek Super Titan Passive Power Conditioning for Amplifiers
    Accessories: Custom Acrylic Equipment Stands, Klaudio Ultrasonic RCM

    Comment


    • Rob
      Rob commented
      Editing a comment
      Joe, you have to admit this isn't good for TechDas dealers, esp if you're trying to close a sale on a new one.

    • Joe Pittman
      Joe Pittman commented
      Editing a comment
      Agree Rob. Not only bad for TechDas dealers especially here in the US but audio in general. Fortunately I'm not a TechDas dealer, but I got really close to pulling the trigger. I'll be getting a VPI Vanquish instead...

    • Guest's Avatar
      Guest commented
      Editing a comment
      It may not be good for the dealer that a buyer of his ne plus ultra audio thing sold it in the first place.

  • #3
    I've gotten several pieces for pennies on the dollar. ROI is very poor in audio, for sure. I thought speakers took the biggest hit, but this?? DAMN!!

    Comment


    • #4
      The Singapore location of the seller certainly isn't helping the sale any.
      Analog: Holbo Turntable, Transfiguration Proteus; Forsell Air Reference, Transfiguration Phoenix S; Rega RP-8, VdH Crimson XGW; VPI Prime Signature, VAS Nova Mono, VAS Nova Signature, Symphonic Line RG-8
      Digital: Mac mini 6,2 with YFS PS-12M LPS; Exogal Comet Plus, Exogal Ion PowerDAC
      Electronics: Aurorasound Vida, Channel D Lino C; Merrill Cara, Gryphon M-100 Mkii (pair)
      Cables: Morrow, Gryphon interconnects; YFS USB cable; Morrow, XLO, Channel D phono cables; Morrow, Gryphon, Goertz speaker cables

      Comment


      • user510
        user510 commented
        Editing a comment
        Yes. Singapore. Now a city state and modern manufacturing center. Once, centuries ago, a hive of sea-going piracy. That said, this is likely more to do with supply and demand. -Steve

    • #5
      Yup....a lot of money to wire overseas. Smokin' deal though.
      Christian
      System Gear

      Comment


      • #6
        Originally posted by Rob View Post
        this is almost too hard to watch, I think the seller slashed his price a few times: https://www.audiogon.com/listings/tu...-analog-680602

        What is the true used value of current high-end gear and is this a reflection of poor perceived value? there was a time, believe or not when dealers would buy gear off flippers just so it wouldn't impact the sale of new gear. I've been on audiogon almost since the beginning, back then 40% off for a current piece was fair, then 50% became the norm. this TechDas is closer to 65% off...wow.
        Is the MSRP the same (or equivalent to US) in Singapore?
        **************************************************
        Every day is a good day to play analog.
        - 12" 33-1/3 RPM or 45 RPM vinyl
        - 10.5" 15ips or 30ips tape
        **************************************************
        Every day is a good day for live music.
        **************************************************

        Comment


        • Rob
          Rob commented
          Editing a comment
          like the retail price difference between Lyra carts in Japan vs here?

        • Dre_J
          Dre_J commented
          Editing a comment
          Ah, So you know where I was going with that question.

      • #7
        If you want ROI buy real estate. Most of our toys and possessions lose value unless they become classics.
        Turntable: - 1. Fairchild 750/OMA slate plinth
        2. Analog Engineering AE-2008 MinusK support.
        Tonearm: 1. Schroder Custom
        2. Schick 12"
        3. Abis SA-1
        Cartridge: Miyajima Kansui and Premium BE Mono
        PhonoPre: AprilSound LR, EMIA Strain Gauge, EMIA silver SUT
        CD: Wadia 860x
        Server: Innuos Zen Mini Mk3
        DAC: Computer Audio Design 1543 Mk2
        Preamp: Bent Audio TAP-X w silver autoformers
        Amplifier: AprilSound SET50 monoblocks
        Speaker: Pioneer PAX-30C

        Comment


        • #8
          I almost bought a Walker in mint condition 5 years ago. The owner had moved to Europe and the table was still in the crate. It was behind one generation so had I made the move I would have sent it directly to Lloyd for the update. Price? $12k for the purchase. I have said before that anytime I sell on Audiogon you have to go in knowing you can no longer get 50% of retail anymore and even at 40% of retail you will probably pay for shipping too.
          TW Acustic TT with Ref motor & controller; Tri-Planar Arm; Ortofon Windfeld-Ti Cartridge, Harmonix-Combak platter mat & weight; PS Audio Stellar Phono Preamp; KLAudio Ultrasonic Record Cleaner.

          Bluesound Vault-2 Music Server & Streamer

          VTL 6.5 preamp Series II
          Pass Labs 150.8 Amp

          Piega C711 Loudspeakers

          Symposium Osiris Rack; Symposium Platforms and Roller Blocks plus grade 2.5 Balls

          Acoustic Revive RR-888 Low Frequency Pulse Generator, Synergistic Research 12 UEF SE Line Conditioner, Level 3 HC AC Cord and Level 3 power cords, Synergistic Carbon fiber wall plates, Synergistic Research Orange Outlet, Furutech NCF Booster Braces, Audio Art Ref IC, MIT Oracle IC, synergistic Research Atmosphere X Euphoria Level 3 Balanced ICs, Synergistic Research Euphoria Level 3 Speaker Cables, Synergistic Research Cable Risers.

          Sennheiser HDV 650 Headphone Amp; Sennheiser HD800s Headphones.

          Comment


          • #9
            This would be a good (safe?) deal for someone like Gary who travels to Singapore a couple times a year. He could make sure the unit is operational, pack and ship.

            Comment


            • #10
              Not everyone wants a $100k table or even at $39k or or or. Pays to be darn sure on a purchase in those price ranges if your looking for resale in the years to come.
              .
              Chris
              ----------------------------------------------------------------
              Kef 201/2, Pass xa30.5, W4S STP-SE, Manley Chinook, VPI Classic, Dynavector DV20x2L, ExaSound e32, Acoustic Zen cables. (Office): Vincent SP331 Mkll, Quicksilver Pre, Lumin D1, (Ken Lau Signiture Edition PSU), Bryston BCD-1, Vapor Audio Breeze, WooAudio W6se,Questyle Audio CMA800R LCD-3,HD800s, HD600, Mr Speaker Ether C Flow,

              Comment


              • #11
                It seems, quite obviously, like way too much depreciation for a mere 2 years ownership. I notice one speed control button cover is missing. Does this by itself knock down the value?
                Seller is a dealer with some history. Likely not a scam.
                Note about U.S. dealers and pricing. This one, unless it has some other issues not seen in the ad, could be a good flip. If given enough time to get past any economic uncertainty in this current tumultuous world political climate. Otherwise, a TechDAS Air force One for $39,500.00 might be a gem to hold on to. Anyone care to calculate the paypal fees? yeowww
                -Steve
                webmaster at The Analog Dept.
                system list:Classe' CAP 151 integrated, Carver TX-11b Tuner, NHT 2.9 Speakers, Thorens TD124 ( plus other Thorens models), Otari MX-5050 BII-2 R2R, Jolida JD100 cd player, ML-9600 digital recorder

                Comment


                • #12
                  Maybe part of it is this industry goes in fads. Especially when it comes to high priced items. Couple of years ago, the AF1 was the bee's knees in Asia. Seems to have been supplanted lately by the Kronos that is around that price new?
                  Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                  Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                  ________________________________________

                  -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
                  -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
                  -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                  -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
                  -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                  -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                  -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                  -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                  -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                  -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

                  Comment


                  • Beaur
                    Beaur commented
                    Editing a comment
                    There's the real rub. The fashionistas have moved on to the "gear of the moment" which happens to be half the retail of the AF1 bringing down any resale. Also, the market for people that can afford a $40K TT and not a $100K one with support from dealer etc is fairly small I would assume. The trickle down works with $10 preamps selling for $5 or 6K but seems to break at these higher price points.

                  • MylesBAstor
                    MylesBAstor commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Agreed. That 100K table might just be your last. Better make the pick count.

                • #13
                  Originally posted by Rob View Post
                  this is almost too hard to watch, I think the seller slashed his price a few times: https://www.audiogon.com/listings/tu...-analog-680602

                  What is the true used value of current high-end gear and is this a reflection of poor perceived value? there was a time, believe or not when dealers would buy gear off flippers just so it wouldn't impact the sale of new gear. I've been on audiogon almost since the beginning, back then 40% off for a current piece was fair, then 50% became the norm. this TechDas is closer to 65% off...wow.
                  That still happens on occasion but more with reviewers. Manufacturers don't want the price of customer's purchases devalued by reviewers selling stuff on line. Many manufacturers BTW watch sites such as Audiogon like a hawk. They look especially for dealers flipping stock, etc. Also transshipping domestically or internationally. Some manufacturers really try and support their dealers and watch for dealers selling outside of their territory.
                  Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                  Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                  ________________________________________

                  -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
                  -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
                  -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                  -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
                  -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                  -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                  -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                  -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                  -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                  -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

                  Comment


                  • MylesBAstor
                    MylesBAstor commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Think part of it is related to their being so many more manufacturers nowadays too Fred?

                  • fcrowder
                    fcrowder commented
                    Editing a comment
                    There is no doubt that part of the problem is the proliferation of manufacturers; however, I think that is only part of the story. Many manufacturers are hard pressed by the economics of Asian markets where it is not unusual for the importer to receive a product for 35% of retail. This in turn squeezes the manufacturer to raise the retail price. There is also the perception by buyers that the higher the retail price, the better the product. A digital stack at $130K must be better than one selling for a fraction of that price. So again, there is little connection between price and value which I think is reflected on Audiogon. There is also the phenomena of many of the same product coming onto the market when the "insiders" find out that a new model or significant upgrade in about to come to market, fearing that the new product will severely depress the value of what they currently own. Again, the buyers are Audiogon are pretty savvy.

                  • MylesBAstor
                    MylesBAstor commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Great insights!

                • #14
                  Are there some brands that hold their value more than others? Certainly there are few brands that rarely come up for sale either because a) there weren't many made or b) owners hangs onto the product.
                  Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                  Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                  ________________________________________

                  -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
                  -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
                  -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                  -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
                  -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                  -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                  -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                  -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                  -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                  -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

                  Comment


                  • fcrowder
                    fcrowder commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Yes, some brands do hold their value better than others for exactly the reasons suggested. Cases in point are Rockport turntables (although not necessarily their speakers), Nordost Odin wire products, and older tubed McIntosh and Marantz amps. Some escalate in price given their rarity and reputation, such as Western Electric 300B tubes (and for that matter other WE gear) and Telefunken cca tubes.

                • #15
                  #12.1

                  Beaur commented
                  03-15-2017, 06:16 AM

                  There's the real rub. The fashionistas have moved on to the "gear of the moment" which happens to be half the retail of the AF1 bringing down any resale. ....
                  If you want to be happy with your stereo, Is the moral of the story to stay away from audio forums? ;->



                  Comment

                  Working...
                  X