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  • Is It Just Me...

    Does anyone else look at many speaker setups and just get the feeling that the speakers are too close to the front wall? Especially at audio shows (OK that's a special situation) but in home systems too. I know that some setups are trying to get more bass reinforcement but it seems to me a question of quality of bass vs. quantity of bass.
    Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
    Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
    ________________________________________

    -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
    -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
    -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
    -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
    -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
    -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
    -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
    -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
    -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
    -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

  • #2
    The systems that I have seen non shows the speakers seem to be further out in the room as space permits of course. IN both of my setups, in my rather small office my speakers (rear ported) are 23" from the rear wall and 23" from the sides. Bass at times can be a little overbearing but a sock works if needed until I can get some panels that are WAF. In my big room TV /movies the speakers are 40" from the rear wall and almost 4' from the sides. Bass is not a problem, but ! when we have company the speakers are moved back towards the wall to keep little fingers from playing with the grills plus it looks a little more welcoming. The Big Room is WAF monitored.
    Chris
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Kef 201/2, Pass xa30.5, W4S STP-SE, Manley Chinook, VPI Classic, Dynavector DV20x2L, ExaSound e32, Acoustic Zen cables. (Office): Vincent SP331 Mkll, Quicksilver Pre, Lumin D1, (Ken Lau Signiture Edition PSU), Bryston BCD-1, Vapor Audio Breeze, WooAudio W6se,Questyle Audio CMA800R LCD-3,HD800s, HD600, Mr Speaker Ether C Flow,

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    • #3
      Agreed on placement. Owning a nice system and then compromising its performance is sad.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post
        Does anyone else look at many speaker setups and just get the feeling that the speakers are too close to the front wall? Especially at audio shows (OK that's a special situation) but in home systems too. I know that some setups are trying to get more bass reinforcement but it seems to me a question of quality of bass vs. quantity of bass.
        its not just the bass, everything is impacted, image specificity, sound staging, et, etc. you see it constantly in member's systems photos. I bite my tongue when I see it because its often a prominent poster or contributor with lots of opinions people take to heart and you just know their system can't sound anywhere near optimum. this wasn't brought up but it will be, the WAF thing has no relevance to audio esp where the speakers are going to dominate the space and be fairly out into the room...if my balls were in her purse I'd just assume pick another hobby.
        TechDAS | Graham Eng | ZYX | B.M.C. | Boulder | Magico

        "Listening to Analogue music is an act of rebellion in a digital gulag" - Simon Yorke

        Comment


        • cpp
          cpp commented
          Editing a comment
          maybe your not married, but In a family room like ours its not a dedicated room like you might have so the WAF does have relevance considering family visit and the grand kids. Before the kids get there we move the speakers back, when the kids leave they come back to their marked location. FYI, my wife and I do have others hobbies which we do together (collecting vintage muscle cars, international travel, kayaking and fishing) instead of setting in some freaking chair 24x7 alone letting time go by listening to music.. After 32 years of marriage I'm glad my balls have somewhere to reside.

      • #5
        Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post
        Does anyone else look at many speaker setups and just get the feeling that the speakers are too close to the front wall? Especially at audio shows (OK that's a special situation) but in home systems too. I know that some setups are trying to get more bass reinforcement but it seems to me a question of quality of bass vs. quantity of bass.
        It's nothing new Myles you just get to see more pictures now than ever. Look at some setups from 50's & 60's the speakers were right up against the wall. Of course the argument is they were designed that way, but its not always true and many of them will sound better in an optimized setup. Speaker setup isn't easy specially when dealing with large heavy ones, then you need experience and knowledge of how to setup a particular speaker in a particular room. Sometimes people, even those with very expensive systems look at a sales brochure or web page with speakers positioned for aesthetics and they copy that in their own home.

        david
        Manufacturer: American Sound Turntables and The Nothing Rack
        Distribution: NEODIO

        Special Sales: van den Hul
        Industry Representation: Lamm, Kharma OLS Speakers, Ortofon, ZYX, Keith Monks, Audio Desk, Jensen Transformer, Venta Airwasher

        Unique Items: Vintage Horn Speakers
        http://www.audionirvana.org/forum/ti...stening-room-1
        http://www.audionirvana.org/forum/ti...earfield-setup

        Comment


        • #6
          How far out from the front wall is everybody's speakers? Mine are about 5 feet...
          Magico M-Project, CAT JL7SE, CH Precision L1/X1/P1, Kronos Pro Limited Edition/SME 3012R/Atlas SL/Opus-1, Schiit Yggdrasil, ZenWave D4 ICs & SCs

          Comment


          • #7
            Originally posted by david k View Post

            It's nothing new Myles you just get to see more pictures now than ever. Look at some setups from 50's & 60's the speakers were right up against the wall. Of course the argument is they were designed that way, but its not always true and many of them will sound better in an optimized setup. Speaker setup isn't easy specially when dealing with large heavy ones, then you need experience and knowledge of how to setup a particular speaker in a particular room. Sometimes people, even those with very expensive systems look at a sales brochure or web page with speakers positioned for aesthetics and they copy that in their own home.

            david
            How about those K-Horns?
            Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

            Comment


            • #8
              Originally posted by Madfloyd View Post
              How far out from the front wall is everybody's speakers? Mine are about 5 feet...
              Mine are almost 7' from the rear wall to the front of the speakers.
              Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

              Comment


              • #9
                Originally posted by mep View Post

                How about those K-Horns?
                They need to go right up in the corners, preferably identical ones and the bass cabinets caulked to the walls for best results. Wood panels or thin wood walls result in a colored sound, the more solid the wall the better.

                david
                Manufacturer: American Sound Turntables and The Nothing Rack
                Distribution: NEODIO

                Special Sales: van den Hul
                Industry Representation: Lamm, Kharma OLS Speakers, Ortofon, ZYX, Keith Monks, Audio Desk, Jensen Transformer, Venta Airwasher

                Unique Items: Vintage Horn Speakers
                http://www.audionirvana.org/forum/ti...stening-room-1
                http://www.audionirvana.org/forum/ti...earfield-setup

                Comment


                • #10
                  Originally posted by david k View Post

                  They need to go right up in the corners, preferably identical ones and the bass cabinets caulked to the walls for best results. Wood panels or thin wood walls result in a colored sound, the more solid the wall the better.

                  david
                  I knew that Dave, all except the part about caulking them to the walls. I was just listing them as an example of speakers that really were designed to be place not only up against the rear wall, but in the corner as well.
                  Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

                  Comment


                  • david k
                    david k commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Coupling them with a solid structure will further clean up the sound but it won't do much with a typical sheetrock wall. Do you have or had them Mep?

                    david

                • #11
                  Originally posted by mep View Post

                  Mine are almost 7' from the rear wall to the front of the speakers.
                  How deep/long is your room? I bet you get some great depth!
                  Magico M-Project, CAT JL7SE, CH Precision L1/X1/P1, Kronos Pro Limited Edition/SME 3012R/Atlas SL/Opus-1, Schiit Yggdrasil, ZenWave D4 ICs & SCs

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    Ian- My room is 23' long. David-I have never owned K-horns.
                    Micro Seiki SX-8000 table with flywheel, SME 3012R arm, SME 312S arm, Lyra Etna SL and Dynavector XV-1S cartridges, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 tape deck, Ampex 350 repros, Roon Nucleus Plus server, PS Audio DSJ DAC, ARC Ref 6 pre, ARC Ref 75 amp, JBL 4345 speakers, and Def Tech Ref subs.

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      Agreed Myles, many speakers seem too close to the front wall. If using a shared living space, you may not have any choice though.

                      My room is also 23' deep and the tweeters are about 10.5' from the front wall. My sitting position is almost up against the rear wall/rack. Most will say my setup looks odd, but this general area gives the best balance of bass, imaging, and soundstaging response. I need to play with toe in now.
                      Kronos Sparta -> Trinity Phono -> Trinity Pre -> CH Precision A1 -> Magico S7s

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        Originally posted by Rob View Post

                        its not just the bass, everything is impacted, image specificity, sound staging, et, etc. you see it constantly in member's systems photos. I bite my tongue when I see it because its often a prominent poster or contributor with lots of opinions people take to heart and you just know their system can't sound anywhere near optimum. this wasn't brought up but it will be, the WAF thing has no relevance to audio esp where the speakers are going to dominate the space and be fairly out into the room...if my balls were in her purse I'd just assume pick another hobby.
                        Agreed about the multitude of effects.
                        Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
                        Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
                        ________________________________________

                        -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
                        -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
                        -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
                        -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
                        -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
                        -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
                        -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
                        -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
                        -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
                        -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

                        Comment


                        • #15
                          a simple test to see if your speakers are too close to the back wall is turn the speakers 180 degrees less toe in sit on the floor with your head resting against the tt and see if it sounds better. Free helpful hints are worth every cent you payed for them.

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