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Magico "A" series speaker?

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  • #31
    I am attending the press release event for these speakers here in the UK on the 8th February 2018, so will give some feedback once I have heard them, I'm sure they are going to be an outstanding speaker, also Alon Wolf will be there for questions.
    Hi-Fi
    Wilson Audio Yvette Speakers - McIntosh Labs MA8000 - Mytek Brooklyn DAC + PSU - dCS Network Bridge - Cyrus CDi Player - Clearaudio Concept Wood Turntable, Concept MC Cartridge - Nordost Quantum Q4 - Chord Cables Signature USB - Transparent Ultra Gen5 Speaker cables - Transparent Power cables - GIK Acoustic Panels...

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    • #32
      Originally posted by geceon View Post
      A product is only be considered good, if it retains high second hand value over the years. I had bought a new pair of S5 after market search, auditioning etc. and a year later MK2 version is announced. Same happened to S3 owners. Magico speakers cannot be upgraded when the higher MK versions come to the market. People have spent lots of money for Q Line and all of us know it will not exist soon. The old series with wooden cabinet also have the same problem. M5 is a disaster for the owners. The retail price was $90.000 and you can get one for more or less $20.000 after couple of years. I believe Magico is a perfect choice for very rich and second hand hunters. The make excellent designs and even if you buy an old product it is still current technology. I want to upgrade my S5 to S7 but I will do it when the S7mk2 version hits the market. So I get a used S7 for less than half of current retail price.
      If they want to retain second hand value they should do what Audio Note does and keep the same model in the line-up for 20 years - then simply add more versions. I really helps consumers. For example I bought my Audio Note J/Spe back in 2003 and it still sells today but the price today is double what it was back then. So when I sold my AN J/Spe I sold it for 20% more money that I originally paid - in other words I lost nothing (a little inflation sure but had I bought ANY other speaker in 2003 I would have lost at least half.

      Since then Audio Note has had many new versions of the AN J/Spe - they came out with a version with a better hemp woofer and AlniCo versions etc but because they still make the AN J/Spe - it helps all us owners have a product that doesn't lose value.

      And the other fact is that if it was good in 1995 it should still be good in 2005 and 2015 and 2020 etc. They have better versions yes - but the platform is strong. It;s also why I can sell my AN OTO integrated amp for more than I paid and my AN Turntable 2 for 20% more than I paid (For a turntable!!)

      This approach can work for all other manufacturers - just keep the product in the stable - if it needs to be "improved wholesale" every 2-4 years then it wasn't worth buying in the first place. Quality isn't something that becomes second rate crap in 4 years. But that is what is implied in audio gear these days. The Sugden A21 integrated amp has been selling for 50 years with only a few changes - mainly better heat dissipating materials and cosmetics. And it still wins blind tests against the new this week hyped to the hilt amp that will be completely forgotten in 4 years.

      The stuff that lasts 2-3 decades - might actually be worth more of people's time than very expensive technobabble to the hilt products that almost always don't live up to the hype when one stops reading the catalog and the specs and actually listens to the stuff. PS this has nothing at all to do with the sound of Magico - but a general commentary on the way all companies could help their customer's retain value. Magico is one of the few floorstanders I have enjoyed. But I would not like to lose so much value after say 10 years owning them. But perhaps they don't have the space or money to be able to stock the parts for a long duration?

      Comment


      • mep
        mep commented
        Editing a comment
        So basically what you are saying when I read between the lines is that AN (UK) has figured out the business model for selling super high priced gear to Asian markets and other companies should follow their lead. And what piece of AN (UK) gear did you buy and sell 10 years later for more money?

      • Rob
        Rob commented
        Editing a comment
        How did a Magico A3 thread turn into an AN-can-do-no-wrong manifesto?? Richard, if you want to bloviate about AN start a new thread!

      • Richard Austen
        Richard Austen commented
        Editing a comment
        Hi Mep

        sorry for late reply but I have been on vacation. The specific items - my AN J/SPe speaker bought in 2003 sold in December 2016 for 17% more than I originally paid. I can sell my OTO Phono SE amplifier for about 15%-20% more than I paid back in 2003 and I also sold my AN TT2 turntable for 20% more than I paid (after only 3 years of ownership).

        I know posters get on my case for being a fanboy but when you buy audio gear that sounds excellent and winds up being less than free - most of them would "bloviate" about their choices and would want others to have the same delight.

        I use AN as an example because I own it but it probably would apply to the Sugden A21. This amplifier has sold for 50 years and if you had bought one say in 1992 for the then price of around $1300-$1500 there is a more than decent chance that today you would sell it for $1300-$1500. The new ones are around $3600. The new model is better in terms of heat handling parts and casework but the design is the same. In other words it is very possible to own the amp for 25 years and not costing you anything. If instead you did something stupid like me and trust Stereophile and bought the hyped to the hilt Arcam Delta 290 for $1300 you'd be lucky to get $250 for it - and it sounded vastly worse as well. So a double whammy.

        Perhaps other have other examples I simply don't know what they are.

    • #33
      ​Alon Wolf, founder of high end loudspeaker brand Magico brought his latest loudspeaker, to show the press just what could be done if you make the decision to invest in building larger quantities....
      Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
      Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
      ________________________________________

      Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers, cj ART300 40th Anniversary monoblock Amplifiers; cj GAT preamplifier Series 2; Doshi V3.0 and Thoress Mk. 2 phonostages; VPI Vanquish turntable/12-inch 3D tonearm/12-inch Fat Boy, Klaudio arm, Lyra Atlas SL, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges; Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads/Doshi V3.0 tape stage run balanced; Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Allnic cables, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, MG Audio, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies Power Cords. Stillpoint Aperture panels, MPod Magico feet, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC. Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks; Audiodharma Cable Cooker; Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

      Comment


      • #34
        Had a chance to hear the A3 yesterday at the LAOCAS meeting at Scott Walker Audio. They were powered by Devialet amps, in an all digital display. The room had a lot of Synergistic Research treatment too. Also, I've heard that room being a little tubby or muddy in the bass at times, so I factored that into my opinion. Overall, though I haven't always warmed up to the Magico sound as I've heard it at past Newport shows, I have to say it was very impressive this time around. Surprising in their depth and power at the bottom end, huge soundstage, and a totally effortless sense of dynamics. It was enough to make me rethink my past view of Magicos as high-end audiophilia with no soul.

        Sorry the photo is out of focus, took it with my phone over my head to get over the crowd.
        Click image for larger version

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        Also got to hear the ELAC Adante floor standers and the Goldenear References, but in a very different sounding room with all McIntosh gear, so no direct comparison. I will say that the options in the $5 to $10 thousand dollar range have never been better, and all three of these are serious contenders.
        Steve Lefkowicz
        Senior Associate Editor at Positive Feedback
        --------------------------------------------------------
        http://www.audionirvana.org/forum/ti...ounding-system

        Comment


        • Rob
          Rob commented
          Editing a comment
          i like the form factor and small footprint. they dont appear to take anymore space than my LS3/5as.

        • Steve Lefkowicz
          Steve Lefkowicz commented
          Editing a comment
          A little bit bigger around, but a whole heck of lot heavier!

      • #35
        Well, I wouldn't be so harsh against a graphene. Yup, the "everything is better with graphene" gets old fast but truth be told, it is really impressive material. Honestly i don't too care about which material gonna turn better in the end. I just wanna best audio experience.

        Comment


        • #36
          Originally posted by Danie View Post

          Well, I wouldn't be so harsh against a graphene. Yup, the "everything is better with graphene" gets old fast but truth be told, it is really impressive material. Honestly i don't too care about which material gonna turn better in the end. I just wanna best audio experience.
          Glad to have you aboard!



          Things is, given the rapid changes in material science, it’s inevitable we will eventually see a new lighter and stiffer material down the road. Or improved graphene material.
          Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
          Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
          ________________________________________

          Magico S5 Mk.2 speakers, cj ART300 40th Anniversary monoblock Amplifiers; cj GAT preamplifier Series 2; Doshi V3.0 and Thoress Mk. 2 phonostages; VPI Vanquish turntable/12-inch 3D tonearm/12-inch Fat Boy, Klaudio arm, Lyra Atlas SL, Fuuga, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges; Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads/Doshi V3.0 tape stage run balanced; Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 5, Allnic cables, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, MG Audio, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies Power Cords. Stillpoint Aperture panels, MPod Magico feet, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC. Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz racks; Audiodharma Cable Cooker; Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA platforms.

          Comment


          • #37
            I'm impressed that Magico has managed to lever their success further down the market as they have developed new speakers. I remember initially the layered plywood models the success of which allowed for the first aluminum models, the success of which led to being able to acquire aluminum extrusions for the S models. Then the pre-sold M-Pros allowed development of the new M models. Finding a vendor to supply metalwork allowed the larger scale production of the new A series. Driver development seems to be amortized across the entire product line.

            Thing is, if every new product line is an advancement in it's class, then the older models are not going to hold their value let alone appreciate. Not like it's an old Mac 240 or something. A few classics from the golden age and a very few niche products might appreciate or at least hold their value. But face it, 99% of whatever you buy drops in value as soon as you walk out the door.

            Anyhow, good job Magico. I don't really see how they could produce anything at much lower price points than the A series. Well, maybe if there is a breakthrough in driver fabrication and the price drops on caps and coils.

            Comment


            • Steve Lefkowicz
              Steve Lefkowicz commented
              Editing a comment
              They might drop in price on the used market, but they don't drop in quality, so they actually increase in value for the person that buys them used.

            • MylesBAstor
              MylesBAstor commented
              Editing a comment
              Magico was in part able to bring the cost down by outsourcing the cabinet construction and making a big financial commitment to producing a large number of A3 Speakers. As we know, the more you can make, the prices of materials goes down.

            • Rust
              Rust commented
              Editing a comment
              Steve - In this case I was defining value in monetary terms partially in response to an earlier post about Audio Note gear. What a person might consider of worth not related to price is an individual preference.

              Myles - My point exactly even if not accurately expressed. I used to deal with outsourcing a fair amount with industrial systems. A good vendor was a joy because of the availability of additional engineering and design expertise, and physical resources. A bad vendor can be a nightmare in rework, missed deadlines, test failures and so on. The saying is pick two of the following three, fast, good and cheap. You can never have all three.

              Even ten years ago Magico might not have been able to successfully outsource the metalwork. Advances in automated precision machining make such things possible today. I hope Magico is very successful in this endeavor.
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