BadBob's sound room remodel

[BadBob]

Hey y'all, my long awaited and much planned for music room remodel is underway. Rather than repost what has been posted on another forum, you can read all about how I came to this room, my initial setup, etc here: http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showth...amp-ARC-for-me

Yes, its a couple pages of posts, but if you're curious of the back story, visit the thread above.

As for what's happening now... here's a few pics.

[JCOConnell]

Good luck with your project.

[BadBob]

Well, a bit of a slack week wrt progress on the build-out. A couple of HVAC ducts were supposed to have been relocated last week, but the tech ended up missing the appt so that was rescheduled for this week. That prevented the electrician from finishing installation of recessed lights, and hence getting the electrical cover inspection done. So missing a single dependency shifts the entire schedule one week. There will likely be another before its over.

Next week will be a big week as the acoustic treatment in the ceiling will be installed, then we can move on to steps like sheetrock, tape & texture, piant, etc.

Hopefully before Christmas all will be complete.

[Long Live Analog]

Looking good Bob, I'm liking your kitty supervising the project...

[BadBob]

Nothing to show today via pictures... but Bonnie's crew (SoundSense) arrived this morning to begin the treatment in the ceiling. We expect it will take four long days to get everything done. Then, next week will have spray insulation added to the walls of the wine cellar, finish insulating the walls, and begin sheetrock, tape, and texture. Aside from the week delay we had for moving the HVAC the balance of the schedule seems to be on track. Hoping for completion early December.

I'll post a pic or two as the week progresses.

[BadBob]

Last week the "high hat mufflers" and NoiseOut was installed in/on the ceiling. I had reduced scope a little to save some $$, and was just going to put the BlueJeans insulation in the niche walls. But, too much insulation was ordered so I was able to really cram the bays full of the BlueJeans using 2 layers, and there was also more NoiseOut ordered than was needed, so I installed it on the walls myself. Holy crap that stuff is heavy. I first tried hanging a full length section on my own and used up about 3 days of mojo on that one panel. I was exhausted! But I was able to get the two niche areas coated with the NoiseOut before the sheetrock guys got here this morning to get the drywall hung.

Taping, priming, and adding texture will take until middle of next week, and then the painters come! Following that the wine cellar racks and glass will be installed, then the BAD panels and fabric wall covering (to hide the BAD panels). Then all that will remain is curtains and carpet, and a visit from the Wilson rep to setup the speakers.

[MylesBAstor]

Thanks for the pics! That's some project! Did you have someone design the new room or doing this yourself?

[allenh]

Hey Bob, sorry I didn't see this earlier. Out cycling!;-)

Great progress my friend. Is NoiseOut the black stuff in the ceiling? Noise travels way too much in from my basement room to the first and second floors. Can't wait to hear how the stuff works.

I didn't read the WBF thread, but are you doing any special electrical work?

[Guest]

The jig to hold the NoiseOut looks helpful. Guess it works for drywall as well. It does look like the NO could be a bear to manipulate. I did double drywall with green glue on mine - wasn't even aware of NoiseOut.

nice cat :-)

[BadBob]

Hey Bob, sorry I didn't see this earlier. Out cycling!;-)

Great progress my friend. Is NoiseOut the black stuff in the ceiling? Noise travels way too much in from my basement room to the first and second floors. Can't wait to hear how the stuff works.

I didn't read the WBF thread, but are you doing any special electrical work?

Yes, the black stuff on the ceiling/walls is the NoiseOut2 material from SoundSense. It is a very, very heavy mass loaded vinyl that goes between sheetrock and joists. Every seam is sealed, and where there is an opening in the ceiling, e.g. for the recessed lights, that is where the "high hat mufflers" go to ensure the sound does not travel up. The benefit is the ceiling then becomes a little bit of a helmholz resonator and becomes part of the overall acoustic modeling.

As for electrical, I had considered adding a couple more additional dedicated lines. But I was warned by Grant @ Shunyata that additional lines, unless exact same length as others, can create ground loops leading to hum. So I had the two dedicated lines I already installed re-run (because I needed to change the location of one of them). Other than that, no extra special attention to grounding, etc.

[BadBob]

The jig to hold the NoiseOut looks helpful. Guess it works for drywall as well. It does look like the NO could be a bear to manipulate. I did double drywall with green glue on mine - wasn't even aware of NoiseOut.

nice cat :-)

The NoiseOut2 is a mass-loaded vinyl material, extremely dense and heavy. Combined with the "high hat mufflers" and blue-jeans cotton insulation it goes a long way to keeping sound within the room it was created. In my case, I still have an open hallway and opening up the stairs to the first floor, so I am adding curtains lined with multiple layers of another SoundSense product (Lumitex) to slightly reduce the sound travelling up the stairs. More importantly, to keep the sound of the two refrigerators near the top of the stairs from coming into the music room.

I skipped multiple layers of drywall. The NoiseOut behind one layer is enough considering the room can't be completely closed off. And the jig for the NoiseOut was just a modified drywall lift.

Walking around the room where NoiseOut is in the ceiling and walls, a loud hand clap does not create the long decay ring that existed before, keeping in mind there is no other treatment at this point, i.e. bare walls, floor, and one wall with large glass window and two glass doors. If I go down the hallway where the wine cellar is to be located, we did not put the NoiseOut in the walls there or the ceiling—a hand clap in that area rings pretty strongly, so the NoiseOut must really suck the reverb out of the sheetrock. (Fortunately, the wine cellar area will be on the opposite side of a curtain, so that ring and long decay time won't be heard in the music room.)

[BadBob]

Progress update: second layer of mud applied to drywall. Next week will include texture application, then prime and paint. Following that will come installation of new millwork/trim, the custom BAD panels, and the Fabric-Wall system. If things continue on schedule all that will remain going into December will be carpet and curtains.

[MylesBAstor]

Great idea to have the wine cellar so close!

[Guest]

Any plans for lighting control? Lurton dimmers and Picos are an easy and relatively inexpensive option.

[BadBob]

Any plans for lighting control? Lurton dimmers and Picos are an easy and relatively inexpensive option.

Yes, lighting has been a very big part of my design. 13 Lutron RadioRa2 wireless switches mounted in utility room behind the door. 1 wall mounted master, one tabletop master. I put in 17 new recessed LED lights mostly around the perimeter, lighting the walls, niches, and curtains. There will be an acoustic cloud with LED tape light around its perimeter casting reflected light off the ceiling, the niches will have LED tape lighting around the edges, and another acoustic panel mounted to one wall will also have halo effect lighting from LED tape lighting. One light above listening position will let me read the album covers! Lutron masters and app will let me set 'scenes'.

But I will say LED lighting and dimmers adds up very quickly. Nothing relatively inexpensive using LED, though you can spend much, more on fixtures if you want architectural level stuff. I did find some fixtures at $130 per for the fixture and element, compared to $255 per for the next option. Then there is the cost of wiring the room for all those new fixtures. But to me, lighting has a big impact on the overall gestalt of the space.

[BadBob]

So with the painters almost finished, I got around to wiring up a dimmer and installing a couple of the LED recessed lamps/trims. I had chosen 3000°K for all the lamps, and at full brightness or dimmed just a little bit they looked great. But when dimmed all the way down, the light just sort of turned a dull grey. One thing about LED lamps vs halogen or incandescent—when you dim the latter they get warmer/yellower. Not so with LED. There is no color shift as you dim the light. 3000°K did not pass WAF, so I am exchanging the full lot for 2700°K. 17 recessed cans and nearly 100 ft of LED tape light.

Also, thankfully, the LED lamps worked fine with my new Lutron RadioRA dimmers, no flickering and no buzzing. If anyone is in process of remodeling with LED lighting, beware the nightmare of incompatible fixtures & dimmers, as well as the strange inconsistencies within any range from the same mfg.

[allenh]

Thanks for the tip on the RA dimmers. Whatever my contractor put in buzzes.

That's a lot of lights, buddy. I only have 1 LED and waiting for the other 7 incandescents to burn out before I change them. 13 years and counting...