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  • Filtered water

    what water do you guys drink. When out anything in bottles or tap. But in homes it's a reverse osmosis filter setup. Funny thing is down south it's a well and I love the taist of it. No sulfur but plenty of minerals. Now I have to put in one of those whole house filter systems that uses salt and some other stuff to remove the minerals as it was staining my shower glass.
    I installed a bypass for the kitchen sink. I am the only one to drink it my family uses bottles and a water cooler.
    It has BEN tested a few times and is fine.

    Up hear I use a filter as well it's nyc tap
    there is a big difference in taist from the tap before it.
    The filtered has no taist and when I drink a glass it does not bother my stomac as the tap did.

    analog stuff.
    otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
    otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
    sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
    new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
    thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
    thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
    kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
    phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
    speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
    mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
    digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
    Dacs lampi various

  • #2
    This was recommended to me by a nutritionist I trust. One issue with plastic bottles is the presence of BPA. This is BPA free but then again newer studies are showing other plasticizers aren't much better.

    Shop Clearly Filtered at the Amazon Water Coolers & Filters store. Free Shipping on eligible items. Everyday low prices, save up to 50%.
    Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
    Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
    ________________________________________

    -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
    -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
    -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
    -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
    -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
    -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
    -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
    -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
    -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
    -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

    Comment


    • #3
      Question: How do we know our filters do what we claim? The answer: Independent, 3rd Party Laboratory Testing We test our products according to the most Rigorous
      Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
      Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
      ________________________________________

      -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
      -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
      -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
      -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
      -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
      -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
      -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
      -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
      -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
      -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

      Comment


      • BadBob
        BadBob commented
        Editing a comment
        Very important to know the test protocols—in reviewing the results shown for the above, it is apparent the organic molecule rejection rates are in in accordance with testing via surrogate. It is a standard and accepted test to measure removal of chloriform, then all the organics can be shown to be removed at the stated percentages. No company will spend the $$ to test for each of those chemicals when it is legal to just use the chloriform surrogate. This also means that, if your product removes greater than that listed for the surrogate, you cannot state the improved rejection amount unless a test is done specifically for that compound.

        This is a common way companies in the water business inflate their perception in the eyes of the public—if it removes all those things it must be good, right? In general, organic compound removal is the easy part, just use enough granular activated carbon (GAC) at the proper temperature and flow rate and you can have a great effect on organics. But, GAC is completely useless for removal of inorganics (mineral salts, salts of heavy metals, radionuclides, flouride, hexavalent chromium, etc. Also GAC won't remove bacteria, cyst, and virus unless mechanically filtered by putting the GAC into a "block" with a particular rating, say .5 micron. (.2 absolute rated is essential for removal of dangerous bacteriological contaminants. Most filters are "nominal" rated, not absolute, so their effectiveness is questionable should you be in an area with a 'boil water' alert.) Also, carbon blocks typically force water through the sidewall, not the full length of the filter, which is essential for 'contact time'.

      • MylesBAstor
        MylesBAstor commented
        Editing a comment
        It's been a while since I have been in the lab but from what I remember its basically impossible to remove everything anyway with one filter. We had a couple of prefilters like for organics before a set of three other filters in the Milli-Q system to filter our lab water.

    • #4
      I grew up drinking tap water. I'm still here. I'm more concerned with the litter (filters, bottles) ending up in our landfills and oceans.
      Dynavector DV20x2L MC cartridge - Genesis G7.1f speakers - Marantz Reference PM-KI-Pearl Int. Amp. - Oracle Audio Paris MkV turntable - Various Morrow & Valab/King cables

      Comment


      • #5
        Lol yes the fact you post means your here.
        Now understand my view I have Botha disorder and terminal conditions. Having said that I have a ten year old
        and I want him to have a much Better start then I did.
        He has one issue now he needs a enzym to be able to digest one type of sugar. Although he does produce the Enzym it's levels are no though enough.
        Water is what we ingest far more of then anything else.
        My filters are expensive. They are multiple stage and is the same I use for the office salt water reef and fish setup.
        If the toxins that are coming pit of your tap lol we're in that water my 30k tank would be a rock garden or snake pit
        plastic yes Myles who the hell knows anymore what they are. Glass and stainless steel is best
        I do juices and smoothies daily in glass or stainless only.
        I also have a stainless thermos for water.
        While my mom made it to 96 I do feel our lives are filled with poisons at such a level know one can calculate the end effect.
        analog stuff.
        otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
        otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
        sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
        new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
        thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
        thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
        kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
        phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
        speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
        mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
        digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
        Dacs lampi various

        Comment


        • #6
          At home I installed a whole house filtration with three filters plus a softener, at the sinks I have a R/O for drinking, I also have an infra red system to kill bacteria, I have a chlorine wash by pass to wash the crud out of the pipes, If people saw what's in the pipes they would never drink tap water again. I have not had a drink of tap water for over 40 years when I became concerned about what we were accepting as the order of the day in the way of food and liquid ( Fluoride that is added to the water by all municipalities is a serious issue for me ). I started out making my own distilled water in the late 70's and as I learned more about alkalinity for health I discovered that distilled water is very hard ( PH around 6) and can cause inflammation to ones body therefore opening the door for all kinds of disease.

          I added a mineral filter on the R/O to keep the water at above 7.6 PH. Pure R/O is on the hard side of the scale. I have learned so much about the importance of alkalinity by raising Japanese Koi for the past 16 years, ( A $15000.00 Koi graveyard ) I have a very large Koi pond (3500 gallons ) that I must keep the water as pristine as possible otherwise they will take disease . ( They are swimming in their own toilet ) If I allow the alkalinity to drop in the hard zone, below 7 PH they will start to die rapidly.

          Al,here's my take on a water softener, the typical one that uses salt is a bad idea for many reasons, it adds salt to the water that the filters do not remove completely ( it adds up when one drinks 3 qts. of water a day). Any extra sodium in the diet is not a good idea, It is toxic to the environment when back washed, it is expensive to maintain.

          There are several on the market that are considered Green Softeners that do not use salt, any one of them is better than a salt type. As a matter of fact the salt type has been outlawed in many states and municipalities. It is an interesting subject to research and learn about, R/O vs Alkaline vs Distilled. and Salt vs Green

          Don

          Comment


          • BadBob
            BadBob commented
            Editing a comment
            Distilled water is in fact very soft, as it will have nearly zero total dissolved solids. Hardness is a measure of levels of calcium and magnesium, which precipitate out of water as the temperature increases, which is why these ions build up scale in your pipes and water heater. Most mineral salts dissolve at a greater rate as temperature increases, so they stay in solution. But this is not how calcium and magnesium behave, which is why a softener is used, to replace Ca and Mg with Na (sodium), which behave "normally".

            Do you remember growing salt crystals for science when you were in elementary or junior high school? You put salt into a kettle of water until you can get no more salt to dissolve into the water—a saturated solution. Then you heat the water and you can dissolve in more salt—a super saturated solution. Now when the water cools the amount of dissolved salt cannot exceed what the solution can hold at a particular temperature and the excess will precipitate out to form a nifty salt crystal. Ca and Mg behave opposite, as the water temp cools more of the Ca and Mg can dissolve into solution. When heated in your water heater it crystallizes (precipitates) out of solution and fouls your water heater and your pipes.

            pH and hardness are not measuring the same thing. It is possible to have hard water that is acidic or alkaline. Distilled water removes almost all mineral ions, RO typically removes 80-95% depending on age of the RO membrane. The things is, water that is absent mineral salts is also absent any buffer to pH, so adding a tiny trace of anything will have a big impact on pH. For example, the combination RO/DI systems my company produces typically has Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) at zero or 1 part-per-million (ppm). Dissolved carbon dioxide, however, is difficult to remove, and a trace of this remaining in the water will pull the pH down slightly from 7. Consider that CO2, dissolved in water, becomes carbonic acid. In the absence of any buffer (we removed it all when we purified the water) 4ppm CO2 (in a liter of water) will cause the pH to drop to 4. Imaging 3 full pH point swing with only 4ppm CO2. Many people are concerned—oh my goodness! pH 4, that must be a terribly strong acid! I can't drink that! But that is not the case at all. As soon as that water touches your tongue and absorbs some saliva the pH will swing wildly back towards whatever your saliva is at the time. As much baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) as will fit on the head of a pin will move the pH of my 4.0 sample above back to ph 8! Four (4) full pH point swing with only a tiny trace of a weak base (baking soda). Sadly, many folks have only a crude understanding of pH chemistry. Coke-cola is pretty strongly acidic due to the high level of CO2 in solution, and while I don't drink much soda I will gladly drink a coke with pH around 3 or 4 vs. sulfuric acid with the same pH. Simply put, knowing a solution's pH is only part of the story, there are big differences between strong and weak acids, strong and weak bases.

            With respect to KOI, (and all fish) water chemistry is essential to a healthy fish population. Alkalinity spoken here relates to the buffering capacity of the solution, not specifically to the pH of the water.

            I will reserve comments with respect to softeners. There are pros and cons to all designs, and no magic solutions.

          • don
            don commented
            Editing a comment
            Bob I meant to say acidic not hardness I know that they are two different things,

          • MylesBAstor
            MylesBAstor commented
            Editing a comment
            Thanks Bob for the chemistry lesson! Memory lane.

            Acidity of drinks and food is whole 'nuther topic for another day. But let's say I wouldn't recommend women drinking Coke since the acidity can leach Ca out of their bones. The whole thing about food acidity and the burden to the kidneys also relates back to osteoporosis and why there are parts of the world where women don't eat anywhere near the recommended levels of Ca yet have very low levels of osteoporosis. That is compared to Western women with high levels of osteoporosis.

        • #7
          Myles

          I do my own test for the major parameters with my Koi testing equipment, I do not trust testing laboratories as they allow certain PPM of toxins to be acceptable ( per the USDA) , the best test is for orp ( organic reduction potential) the true test of pure water, most testing companies do not provide that result.

          Comment


          • BadBob
            BadBob commented
            Editing a comment
            ORP, Oxidation Reduction Potential, is an important consideration in natural waters but not so important in terms of water purity. It is inversely proportional to pH. As pH goes up, ORP always goes down. ORP is derived via the Nernst Equation, see the 1921 nobel prize in chemisty. Hence, as water becomes more and more pure, the pH must, by definintion, narrow in on pH of 7. This means the ORP will also become restricted to its equivalent value with respect to pH.

          • don
            don commented
            Editing a comment
            That is why I drop my PH to around 7 when I sanitize with potassium permanganate for the orp reading other wise the reading will be wrong and the fish will get burnt

        • #8
          Apropos this topic, I was researching why our cat's stainless steel water "fountain" gets so slimy. Aside from saliva, bacteria in the air creates the slime. Using more purified grades of water really does nothing to prevent it.
          I drink bottled water. I'm constantly drinking it, can't go out of the house or to another room without water. I don't remember needing constant watering when I was younger. Is it a function of age, or have I simply been conditioned through marketing to have the bottle with me at all times?

          Comment


          • BadBob
            BadBob commented
            Editing a comment
            The slime you mention is a biofilm. In whole house water systems that remove the chlorine, it is good to have a method to occasionally super-disinfect the pipes (mentioned elsewhere in this thread) where you add a lot of chlorine bleach and flush your pipes 1 or 2 times annually. This will reduce formation of biofilms which can created a very dangerous environment. Legionaries Disease is one of those problems that can occur when biofilm growth is not contained/eliminated/properly dealt with.

          • MylesBAstor
            MylesBAstor commented
            Editing a comment
            Ha! Didn't realize that about Legionaire's Disease.

        • #9
          well, I'm spoiled by my water. it's basically perfect out of the tap.

          I live in the Mountains east of Seattle, the rain clouds come across 8,000 miles of Pacific Ocean, so the air is clean, and it drops rain and snow on the Mountains, then I get the water from a local artesian well water system. and I live next to a watershed-wilderness area. so no development.

          even Seattle water is not as good......although it's pretty good.

          in the rainy season (October-April) I can go outside and hear the 15-20 waterfalls that run down the ridge about a 1/4 mile from my house. it roars. a lovely sound.

          I can't take the subway to Times Square, but water.......it's great.

          all that said; I do have a refer in my barn with all sorts of bottled water too. but I drink plenty straight from the tap. no filters.
          https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/615

          Comment


          • BadBob
            BadBob commented
            Editing a comment
            Not to "rain" on your parade Mike, the rain clouds cross the Pacific with the dust and debris from Fukashima and Chinese coal fired power plants and smoldering toxic waste dumps. Testing has shown contaminant concentrations have grown over time, and it rains down on the western north american continent. Surface waters are most vulnerable, but the ground waters are recharged from snow pack in the mountains, as is your artesian well. That is not to say all ground waters and wells are contaminated, but as testing ability and sophistication improves we are finding more and more traces of contaminants in what were once pristine ground water supplies.

        • #10
          Missed a very big opportunity. Back in the early 1980s, before even Perrier, my wife and I visited one of my best friends in So. CA who moved into a new house. He was a health nut and we helped him install a water distiller under his sink. After jogging out in the heat we would come in a drink the cold, pure water and remark how refreshing it was. Man, we should bottle this and sell it! Nah, who would buy bottled water. The rest is history.

          Since then we have always used a reverse-osmosis filter under the sink for drinking water we keep in a container in the fridge. Except for coffee and wine on the weekends, I don't drink much else. We use tap water for making coffee, cooking and everything else.

          I dislike the plastic waste associated with bottled water so I avoid them except when flying.

          Thiel 7.2s, Manley NeoClassic 250s, Wadia 850, MIT Oracle V3 speaker cables, MIT MI-350 Oracle interconnects, Black Diamond Racing Shelves and Cones in a dedicated room with ASC Tube Traps, Room Tunes and 3 X 20 amp dedicated circuits.

          Comment


          • #11
            Originally posted by Bill Hart View Post
            Apropos this topic, I was researching why our cat's stainless steel water "fountain" gets so slimy. Aside from saliva, bacteria in the air creates the slime. Using more purified grades of water really does nothing to prevent it.
            I drink bottled water. I'm constantly drinking it, can't go out of the house or to another room without water. I don't remember needing constant watering when I was younger. Is it a function of age, or have I simply been conditioned through marketing to have the bottle with me at all times?
            As we grow older, we lose our thirst reflex. So by the time we are say 60 and feel thirsty, we are already 2% dehydrated. So keeping that water bottle nearby is a good thing.

            A good rule of thumb is 8 glasses of water a day. Down in Texas maybe more because of the heat. But do remember excessive thirsty mess could be a sign of other issues and should be checked by a doctor. And you can also drink too much water.

            I don't have the formula at my fingertips but there is as runners know a relationship between weight loss and how much water one should drink. So many ounces equals so many cups of water that need to be replaced.
            Myles B. Astor, PhD, Administrator
            Senior Editor, Positive-Feedback.com
            ________________________________________

            -Zellaton Plural Evo speakers
            -Goldmund Telos 300 stereo amp
            -Goldmund Mimesis 37S Nextgen preamplifier
            -Doshi EVO and Goldmund PH3.8 phonostage
            -VPI Vanquish direct-drive turntable
            -VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy dual pivot tonearm, VPI 12-inch 3D Fat Boy gimballed and SAT LM-12 arm
            -Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, Fuuga Mk. 2, vdh Colibri Master Signature, MutechHayabusa, MOFI Master Tracker, Sumiko Songbird cartridges
            -Technics RS1506 with Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi V3.0 tape stage (balanced)
            -Assorted cables including Transparent XL Gen. 6, Skogrand, Viero, Kubala-Sosna, Audience Au24SX, Genesis Advanced Technologies and Ensemble Power Cords
            -Accessories including Stillpoint Aperture panels, Cathedral Sound panels, Furutech NCF Nano AC receptacles; Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC, Symposium ISIS and SRA Craz 3 racks, Audiodharma Cable Cooker, Symposium Ultra and assorted SRA OHIO Class 2.1+ platforms.

            Comment


            • #12
              Here in Arizona, you can shorten your life by drinking tap water.....I have bottled spring water delivered....dispense it in a cooler/heater.

              Comment


              • #13
                I drink plenty of water the issue is finding a place to pee lol.
                Some really great replies. The plastic waist bothers me too.
                As for salt filters how does it hurt the environment ? Down south I have a well and no sewer or goes back into the ground
                also the RO filters I use adjust the ph to what I am not sure.
                Also I agree on clorine and flouride. But it's good for our teeth and my ten year old gets treatments at the dentist.
                Why do you clean your pipes ? I thought that slime was good for us in keeping the water away from the metal or plastic piping ? Minerals I take in the form of supplements

                can you share aome of the koy pond.
                My marine tank is 600 gallons in all.
                analog stuff.
                otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
                otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
                sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
                new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
                thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
                thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
                kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
                phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
                speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
                mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
                digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
                Dacs lampi various

                Comment


                • #14
                  Myles I read some where that drinking too much depletes electrytes is this true ?
                  analog stuff.
                  otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 made new by soren
                  otari mtr 10 2 track 1/4 1/2 combo made new by soren
                  sota sapphire used eminent tech ver 2 arm
                  new sota nova table has magnetic levitation platter and full speed control and latest motor same arm as above
                  thorens td124 sme ver 2 arm
                  thorens td125 sme ver 2 arm
                  kenwood direct drive sme ver 2 arm
                  phono preamp Ml no 25 all re capped
                  speakers cust infinity IRS V , new caps and LPS , magnets etc.
                  mark levivson pre no 26 amps no 33
                  digital three cust servers , win ser 2016 , AO
                  Dacs lampi various

                  Comment


                  • mkuller
                    mkuller commented
                    Editing a comment
                    I drink a lot of water and pee a lot, too. My lab tests for electrolytes all come back normal (I had my annual physical 2 weeks ago). Your body should be able to deal with extra water intake fine as long as your kidneys are working ok.

                  • MylesBAstor
                    MylesBAstor commented
                    Editing a comment
                    It is called hyponatremia. Drinking greater than a liter of water in an hour can exceed the kidney's ability to excrete. That disturbs the blood's Na/electrolyte balance (not so much depletes) and leads to a condition called water intoxication. Hyponatremia can and has resulted in death.

                • #15
                  Originally posted by MylesBAstor View Post

                  As we grow older, we lose our thirst reflex. So by the time we are say 60 and feel thirsty, we are already 2% dehydrated. So keeping that water bottle nearby is a good thing.

                  A good rule of thumb is 8 glasses of water a day. Down in Texas maybe more because of the heat. But do remember excessive thirsty mess could be a sign of other issues and should be checked by a doctor. And you can also drink too much water.

                  I don't have the formula at my fingertips but there is as runners know a relationship between weight loss and how much water one should drink. So many ounces equals so many cups of water that need to be replaced.
                  Thanks Myles. I did get a good internist here, and am on track health-wise. You are right about the heat, but this need for water is unrelated to that- I actually adopted the Spanish way of living. You really don't see me other than early in the morning or at night. I'm not on siesta, but laying low. We'll go out in the middle of the day sometimes, but it's really just jumping from air conditioned place to place. It's just too hot to be outside in it. I think we're averaging 100F now, and it hasn't gotten REALLY hot. (yet). At a certain point, barring the humidity, the difference between 103F and say 110F is probably significant, biologically, but frankly, I get to a certain point where my system becomes desensitized- I remember being in Palm Desert one year, at a studio facility, and the client said let's take the golf cart, it's too hot to walk over there. I asked him the temp. It was like 114F. All I knew was that it was pretty unbearable. We had those days in NYC many times too. Over 100, brutal humidity and temperature inversion that goes on for days.

                  Comment


                  • Guest's Avatar
                    Guest commented
                    Editing a comment
                    I lived in the bowl in Phoenix for a while. All that business about "it's not the heat, it's the humidity" turns to jelly once you hit 110.
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